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Destiny: FIN


Gorf King
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@Gorf King

 

It's not though. I'd need to organise a trials team, but a headset and tell one of the friends I usually play with that he's out because he doesn't like elimination. Getting a raid team together involves getting a headset, finding five people online, clearing an evening and telling both the friends I play with that they're out because they can't guarantee hours at a time to do the same activity.

 

The light thing is certainly ok now I'm 310. But playing primarily PvP actually topped out at about 285, which meant going into IB 35 light below the people who are great at jumping puzzles. The fact you can raid for weeks and get nothing is the whole reason I can't be bothered with it, and the Crimson doubles ghost was literally only given out because people complained about the utterly shit rewards from that PvP activity. A 2v2 activity that if probably play every week if it was on and might reward decent gear. But instead it's there for a week and everyone gets the same reward regardless of effort, skill or performance.

 

A game that allows you to play in 2/3 people groups, encourages 3 people playing together and equally balances PvP and PvE but decides it's only end game activity is a 6 man PvE event with no matchmaking is fucking stupid.

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It's amazing how quickly my group of chums (all of whom are keen gamers) pretty much largely dropped it from around Jan. Bloodborne, PvZ, WoTs and now Division all get plays - it's just there's no interest in Destiny.

 

 

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17 minutes ago, Gorf King said:

The difference between 310 and 320 makes fuck all practical difference in PvP.  And the raid weapons aren't 'the best' for PVP - in fact, with one notable exception in one specific situation, they aren't even the best for the raid. Also, you can complete the raid loads of times on HM and never get a 320 item drop - whereas playing 7 matches of that Valentines doubles thing got a guaranteed 320 ghost (never got one of them in all my raids). Sure, there's some good stuff in HM raid challenges, but it's not the be-all and end-all. 

 

Ultumately, we all run out of things to do. Still, if you love the PvP and are 310, you will beat anyone who's 320 easily if you're really better than them. So that shouldn't be the thing that stops you getting to the Lighthouse. Not playing in a team might, as you say. But the Online folder here's spawned many a successful group, so maybe give that a go. It's only a few posts' worth of effort. 

 

3 minutes ago, K said:

Matchmakng for the raid would kill it stone dead. Most people's first experience of the Vault of Glass would be being paired up with five other team members with no microphones who run around like mice and don't cooperate in any way.  If that was how you were introduced to the game's best content, you'd never play it again, it's hard enough to do the start of the VoG for the first time if you're communicating with your team.

 

That said, Destiny seems pretty dead anyway, so they probably don't have a lot to lose.

 

Bang on with both points, I was very low 300 and IB solo was no issue at all and never felt like I was disadvantaged against higher rated players!

 

I am quite enjoying dropping in and out of it at the moment and playing some PvP or doing the odd quest to tidy up completion - I hope the spring update is as rumoured bringing the year 1 raids back or of course a load of new content!

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What's the thinking behind wanting to play Destiny constantly? I'm not even sure why Bungie would focus on that as a goal. Surely from a business POV they just want people to buy all the DLC so they just need to focus on bringing players back for that at six-monthly or annual intervals with substantial packages of new content.

 

I can understand the GTAOnline model of constantly drip-feeding new game modes to drive purchases of high-end gear by whales using real money, that doesn't seem to apply with Destiny.

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They've lost loads of players, even though there was that news article a month ago saying it had gained players. Game is on life support at present it seems, until Bungie decide to release some new info about content, which they seem loathe to do.

 

People have said they nickel and dime everyone, but they recently said their Twitch channel would have some news "soon", however they also said that people could pay to subscribe or something to that channel, which seems pointless as Twitch is free.

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10 minutes ago, Mr Ben said:

They've lost loads of players, even though there was that news article a month ago saying it had gained players. Game is on life support at present it seems, until Bungie decide to release some new info about content, which they seem loathe to do.

 

I don't see the problem with leaving it to lie fallow. It's not like people wouldn't come rushing back for a big new piece of paid content.

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I think that's exactly the risk they run, actually. Which is why a significant drop-off in players would worry them. If we all get knee-deep in The Division, or whatever else (Diablo?) then the NEWS that they've added the small amount of new content suggested for Spring won't drag us back.

 

Then it lies fallow until the Autumn. At which point they finally release a more major content drop, and probably expect to be paid for it. If it's not super-compelling, a fallow audience is much less likely to invest en masse. And so on.

 

I suspect Bungie believe consistent high levels of engagement to be key to their maintaining player's interest, and therefore spend, over time.

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17 minutes ago, Pob said:

 

I don't see the problem with leaving it to lie fallow. It's not like people wouldn't come rushing back for a big new piece of paid content.

 

I can’t speak for anyone else, but F2P games and games that use that bubble-wrap, gotta-do-those-dailies F2P structure like Destiny are incredibly addictive - right up until the point where the spell is broken, at which point they become almost repulsive.

 

When I’m into Destiny, I think about it all the time, and almost plan my life around it, and when I’m off it, I’m almost disgusted by the shallow idiot I was when I played it, triple-dropping Three of Coins and joylessly ticking off bounty after bounty while I slog through the Vanguard strike playlist in the vain hope of getting an imaginary object with a number higher than 300 in the description. It is possible to get back into the game (I’ve done it a couple of times), but there’s a big hump to get over in terms of convincing myself that I really want to get back on the treadmill. Plus, tempting back players when you’ve got games like The Division to compete with is going to be a lot more difficult.

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I wonder if Bungie/Activision are rethinking the strategy of keeping players hooked to the point they are actually hating the game? Perhaps that's more damaging in the long-run for a game that doesn't rely on IAP. They're obviously having trouble keeping up with the desire for new AAA content so maybe a better strategy is to put all their effort behind annual TTK-style expansions backed by a marketing campaign to suck people back in. In fact they pretty much said as much with the release of TTK didn't they?

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10 minutes ago, Pob said:

I wonder if Bungie/Activision are rethinking the strategy of keeping players hooked to the point they are actually hating the game? Perhaps that's more damaging in the long-run for a game that doesn't rely on IAP. They're obviously having trouble keeping up with the desire for new AAA content so maybe a better strategy is to put all their effort behind annual TTK-style expansions backed by a marketing campaign to suck people back in. In fact they pretty much said as much with the release of TTK didn't they?

 

I think the problem with that is that they'd effectively be making a new game using their existing engine every year, Ubisoft-style, but without Ubisoft's army of development teams around the world to crank out another expansion while your A-team works on the sequel. Bungie are massive, but they're only a single developer, and from what I gather they never delegate or outsource to other teams. They've got a strong Not Invented Here culture, which is great for producing very distinctive, authored-feeling games, but very bad for pumping out content on the regular.

 

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In relation to my endless complaining that only one type of activity drops high level gear, it's insane that there's so much Destiny content just sitting there, totally pointless to play because it can't reward you with anything exciting. Not just year one content, but year two stuff that is rendered entirely pointless after you've played it once.

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2 hours ago, K said:

 

I think the problem with that is that they'd effectively be making a new game using their existing engine every year, Ubisoft-style, but without Ubisoft's army of development teams around the world to crank out another expansion while your A-team works on the sequel. Bungie are massive, but they're only a single developer, and from what I gather they never delegate or outsource to other teams. They've got a strong Not Invented Here culture, which is great for producing very distinctive, authored-feeling games, but very bad for pumping out content on the regular.

 

 

It seems a strange thing to commit to, then. I thought the ever-expanding world was what Destiny was supposed to be all about. Instead of ploughing huge resources into fully-fledged sequels every two years, just expand what's already there and charge people the same price. But they don't actually seem to be set up to do that.

 

Your point about Ubisoft is exactly why I've got more hope for The Division fulfilling that promise of significantly expanding its borders over time. They've clearly got the resources and the development pipeline sorted for churning out expansive new open environments as evidenced by the AC series. And expanding NYC north, south and east sounds a lot easier than coming up with new Destiny or AC environments. 

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I think they've left it too late to drop the new content. It should have released just before the division to stop people jumping over. I never bothered with loads of games when they released when i was right in to destiny as I'm sure loads of other people did. They've massively messed up by leaving the gap between content too big.

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2 hours ago, K said:

 

I think the problem with that is that they'd effectively be making a new game using their existing engine every year, Ubisoft-style, but without Ubisoft's army of development teams around the world to crank out another expansion while your A-team works on the sequel. Bungie are massive, but they're only a single developer, and from what I gather they never delegate or outsource to other teams. They've got a strong Not Invented Here culture, which is great for producing very distinctive, authored-feeling games, but very bad for pumping out content on the regular.

 

 

Apparently high moon are also working on Destiny now.

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12 minutes ago, Broker said:

 

Apparently high moon are also working on Destiny now.

 

I didn't know that. Maybe they've had to swallow their pride and bring in outsiders to help. 

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That picture is a nice shader.  All the characters have PoE gear on (can tell by the Titan with the stupid helmet and shoulder thing).  I don't mind so much the twitch streams to hype the content, I think they worked well the last few times.

 

The main issue is it is still a month away.  By that time Division will likely have had the first update, which is supposed to be incursions (which may or may not be raids).  If this new Destiny stuff is just old content retooled (and I doubt they are going to be giving much new stuff away for free) then why would I play it over nice shiny new content in a new game?

 

I mean I don't think I ever attempted the hard mode Oryx raid because it all just sounded like extra numbers on the loot.  Not even any fancy abilities on it.  Plus there is nothing else to do with these higher numbers.

 

At the moment I cannot see myself dropping Division for it.  As people gave mentioned on here, I think the Autumn DLC will have to be massive to have much success.  As in content rich, like TTK was.  I just have my doubts in Bungie being able to pull out something worthwhile.

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Now that I think about it, endgame 3 person activities is exactly what I was whining about there not being.

 

The problem with PoE is that they're fucked either way. I can't understand how the looked at a game that functionally had multiple traditional PvP and PvE systems last year, but PoE as a separate thing, and decided not to update PoE to year 2 as part of the Taken King. If it had just stayed as a central activity then it would've provided value, but as an update it's just recycled year one content which isn't going to make people happy.

 

The continued silence is stupid as well "on April 12th something will happen which we'll tell you about next week". Why not make the fucking announcement next week then?

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The problem with PoE isn't that it hasn't been updated; it's that it exists at all. It's the nadir of the series (worst paid-for content expansion ever), and I'd like to see it buried just as much as I'd like to see VoG (and to a lesser extent Crota) resurrected. So yeah, if the new activity and gear involves more PoE, I'm out until they add something proper. And that might be a long time coming.

 

I still find it odd that Bungie developed the best endgame shooter content ever in VoG (and as much as I'm enjoying The Division, I can't see its endgame bettering VoG's sublime mixture of puzzle-solving, adventuring into a mysterious new world, and (YES!) the finest shooter mechanics ever)... and then just never updated it. Simply left it to become monumentally obsolete and fall into disrepair, like that big thing wot Ozymandias built back in the day.

 

Might write a poem about it one day though.

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The weird thing is, I can't imagine it's that hard to rebalance. Bungie must have some kind of tool or matrix for matching light levels with in-game enemies, because the daily missions and the strikes seem to have been balanced appropriately for high-level enemies. There are unique enemies in the VoG, but there must be a pretty straightforward relationship between the light level of a player and the damage output and health of a monster.

 

Gear might be trickier - a Vision of Confluence at 300+ would probably be OP, but everything is OP in Destiny, and it would be a great incentive to lure players back in. It must be more difficult than I'm making it sound, but it can't be *that* difficult, can it?

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