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Wii impressions


labarte
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Yesterday in the break lauch a girl told me she was looking foward the Wii. A real world girl!! I pretended not no be shocked. "Ohhh yeah, the wii, i know what it is, i have read something on the internet"

EDIT: Actually she did not say Wii but "The New Nintendo" which i think it is a great name and it describes perfectly well what the wii is: Nintendo's comeback with new and unique idea of videogaming.

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  • 1 month later...

Dragon Ball Z: Tenkaichi 2 Hands-on

The developers did note to us that they've received tester feedback that using the Wii's controller may tire players. For this reason the Wii version will also have the ability for players to plug in GameCube controllers to control the game the more "traditional" way.

Structure and design-wise the PlayStation 2 and Wii versions will be virtually identical and feature the same levels, characters, story modes, and unlockables.

http://wii.ign.com/articles/725/725543p1.html

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I should imagine this will be the case for quite a lot of 3rd party games which are non-exclusive / are not developed specifically with Wii in mind as the 'lead' platform. It doesn't make financial sense for developers to have to faff around incurring extra expense for new, slightly obtuse control methods when it's not even their lead platform. They'll put in some rudimentary arm wavey commands which won't work that well while leaving you the "option" of playing with the GC controller.

It's a shame in a way, but no one on Earth could - with a straight face - tell me that they didn't know it would happen.

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Reinterpret your move to the nearest of - ooh, five preset actions?

It was fucking rubbish at E3, but I'd be amazed if they haven't done a massive amount of work on the swordfighting since then, it's been brought up in every interview they've done since. If they just make the slashes go in the direction that you move the remote then I won't have a problem with it, it'll still be a hell of a lot more intuitive than sword controls have been in any other game and I won't have to do ridiculous full motions every time I get into a swordfight.

Absolute freedom of movement isn't what the Wii offers; because it can't.

But you can - in the baseball demo the bat followed the motion of the remote before you took the swing.

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How your movements are translated.

Software programmed for a powerful machine, can have so many move presets, that you don't 'see the joins'.

You move, it's mirrored onscreen.

Absolute freedom of movement isn't what the Wii offers; because it can't.

I think your thinking in some kind of "move and it plays a set animation" term? I don't know, but rest assured that programming nowadays can do some nifty things without each and every movement scenario being pre-planned and ready animated 'just in case.

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How your movements are translated.

Software programmed for a powerful machine, can have so many move presets, that you don't 'see the joins'.

You move, it's mirrored onscreen.

Absolute freedom of movement isn't what the Wii offers; because it can't.

Actually, I think I agree with you to an extent. Although I think 3D tracking is possible, I just don't think it's feasible for something like swordfighting because it creates a ridiculous number of logistical problems that would be very difficult to overcome in order to make something is actual fun to play.

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If done well, "presets" won't necessarily hurt immersion.

One of the most immersive games I've played recently is Guitar Hero. Songs in GH are essentially long presets -- controller input is interpreted as "hit" or "miss", with no real variations and no improvisation possible.

Yet the connection between controller and game feels perfect. In fact, this simplified control model feels very empowering -- it's the only way I could ever manage to play like Clapton or Hendrix.

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At least he was honest.

Surely for objects directly controlled by the Wii remote, inverse kinematics could resolve most of the visual problems that would arise from natural movements. Unless you control individual fingers or the shape of a character's mouth there isn't going to be anything that wouldn’t run, in principle, on the Wii hardware.

The real problem isn't with animation, it's with causation and immersion. Using the samurai battlefield example, you could swing your sword about how you please, and your avatar apes your movements correctly using the sort of tracking technology in the baseball game, the IK making sure the relative hand movements are matched by the rest of the arm and upper body. But no matter how you swing the sword your foes still only have a dozen or so death animations - your unlimited actions have strictly limited effects. But that's a problem we're used to, and ragdoll physics and the like are doing a lot to overcome those limits.

But there's still a danger of feeling disconnected from the action, partly as a result of limited causal power but also because of the sort of logistical limitations MID mentioned (e.g. sword-sword collisions being fudged, clipping all over the place etc) which could lead to glaring inconsistencies (your sword can only slice all the way through pre-defined parts of the body etc). But again, these are the same sorts of problems we're used to seeing.

What worries me about such tracking is what happens when the object you control is obstructed and you continue moving in the obstructed direction. I can't really tell, playing it out in my head, if that's going to be a genuine problem.

Mind you, going by the utterly idiotic arm-appearing-onscreen gun pointing in Red Steel it might be better not to have true tracking in games.

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What worries me about such tracking is what happens when the object you control is obstructed and you continue moving in the obstructed direction. I can't really tell, playing it out in my head, if that's going to be a genuine problem.

I don't get the big deal here, or with any of the potential foibles for wii sword.

The sword would be a physical object. Like a crate.

Moving the sword would be like using a HL2 gravity gun to manipulate the crate.

What happens when the crate you control is obstructed by a wall and you continue moving it? Nothing. The physics engine makes sure it behaves realistically and either stops or smashes.

A sword hitting a sword maybe a more delicate collision between two smaller bodies, but that makes little difference to a game engine.

And as for enemy death animations - well, limb severage would pose a pretty huge problem but I'm sure censorship issues can force that one on the back burner. Anything else is no different to using a gun. In Resident Evil 4 if you shoot a leg the leg animation starts. If you then shoot the back, damage is taken, but no second animation kicks in - but so what? It'll hardly be a new echelon of non-reality if you swing a sword into a Red Steel baddies neck and you just get a damage animation that can't be interupted by any further swipes.

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I agree with all of that. It's perplexing to think that people thought free control sword fights were even remotely possible, it would be an absolute nightmare to develop.

I'm more than happy with gesture control, so long as it's developed into a system which is better than what could be achieved with a standard controller.

Aaaarghhh!

It's perfectly possible. I know these are going for a form of pre-made move animation which you activate upon gesture. And what you're saying is that you can't possibly mapout every movement by this method which is pretty obvious (I suppose it's possible to make it almost seem like that but never the less).

But if you just get the computer to generate an animation on top of the actual user movement to speed it up for example and add fire. So say the user makes a full armed diagonal slash the Wii would measure the first part of it, as in the angle it's going in, the starting point and the speed it's going at. It then would take that part and carry on from there so it seems like it's actually going at the speed the user intended and not the slightly delayed input the user actually gave.

wianimatedkw1.png

The burgundy is the user motion, the green represents how much of that is taken from the actual motion and then from those calculations the computer has made from the angle, starting point and speed it can carry on the motion at a higher speed which is what the red represents, the speed the user imagined. Of course it's not quite writing your name into the enemy but it creates a certain degree of accuracy. Plus there are other factors which could create a seemingless user to computer input which I can not explain in Paint.

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Aaaarghhh!

It's perfectly possible. I know these are going for a form of pre-made move animation which you activate upon gesture. And what you're saying is that you can't possibly mapout every movement by this method which is pretty obvious (I suppose it's possible to make it almost seem like that but never the less).

But if you just get the computer to generate an animation on top of the actual user movement to speed it up for example and add fire. So say the user makes a full armed diagonal slash the Wii would measure the first part of it, as in the angle it's going in, the starting point and the speed it's going at. It then would take that part and carry on from there so it seems like it's actually going at the speed the user intended and not the slightly delayed input the user actually gave.

wianimatedkw1.png

The burgundy is the user motion, the green represents how much of that is taken from the actual motion and then from those calculations the computer has made from the angle, starting point and speed it can carry on the motion at a higher speed which is what the red represents, the speed the user imagined. Of course it's not quite writing your name into the enemy but it creates a certain degree of accuracy. Plus there are other factors which could create a seemingless user to computer input which I can not explain in Paint.

Yes, I realise that part of it is completely possible, that wasn't my point. It's the repurcussions of allowing free control that I don't think is possible.

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