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Norante

Superman Returns

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Ah yes, the best bit of the film... that for some insane reason was shown on every single TV show that had anything to do with films. Oh, and it was in the trailer. No doubt it's on youtube as well.

:)

Still worth watching that bit from start to finish.

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Something that didn't look like it could have come from any modern US TV show. Plus the fact that Lois was not in any way scared. WOO, I'M IMPRESSED.

Just kept thinking of Margot Kidder bricking herself hanging from that helicopter and realised I was going to be doing that the whole way through - comparing it to a good Superman movie.

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Lifting the shuttle off? That's when I decided I couldn't take any more.

So you stopped at him lifting off the shuttle, and missed the actual best bit?

The whole sequence of him saving the plane after is perfect.

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2:Little mistakes appear in the film because of the resolution such as the scene where he takes louis back to the planet about 1:15 in. Their is a shot of his face from behind and he has a shaving cut right on his jawbone that sticks out. Being supes this just wouldn't happen and the saving rash on his neck don't look to great either.

A razor made from Kryptonite then?

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So you stopped at him lifting off the shuttle, and missed the actual best bit?

The whole sequence of him saving the plane after is perfect.

Oh well, I think I can live with myself.

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Just watched the Blu-ray of this. Liked the film, but the making off was the icing on the cake for me. I was expecting maybe 20mins of crappyness, but that was a real benchmark in what can be done with making ofs when you have the chance. Longer then the film to I think

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Probably good they cut it. Long, drawn out and booooring.

It also reminded me of something that annoyed me about Returns - what is the point of having Superman be weak to kryptonite when he can be stabbed with a shard of it and lift a mountain made of the stuff into space?

Have to confess, I'm not a big Supes fan though, so would take a lot to interest me.

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Wasn't that scene meant to be held over for what was going to be Superman Returns 2? While Superman Returns wasn't great, I would have liked to seen what Singer would have done with a more action oriented sequel.

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Is there some revisionist history going on with this film, do you think? Looking at the forumite reviews earlier in the thread, it seems that most of us really liked it when it came out. But now, isn't the general wisdom that it's kinda boring?

I love Singer's work so I'm biased, but I liked the film a great deal and thought it was a couple of action setpieces away from awesome. Maybe I should watch it again.

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I loved the film when it first came out it just doesn't hold up well to repeat viewings. The clamour for a new Supes film was just too high and looking back on it, just too damn average. The bit with the plane was fantastic and I'd really wished they'd made the extra effort to do more action pieces. That's all it needed really that and wiping out his son.

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Is there some revisionist history going on with this film, do you think? Looking at the forumite reviews earlier in the thread, it seems that most of us really liked it when it came out. But now, isn't the general wisdom that it's kinda boring?

That aeroplane/spaceplane rescue sequence forgave a lot.

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I think if the film had ended there I would've been very happy. The drudgery that follows feels like it comes from a completely different movie, tonally. It's like Singer channeled the first films just long enough to get the tribute done, then went on a House binge and decided to make everything grey and ambivalent.

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Superman Returns had none of the charm of the first three films (yes even number 3). Reeves was a much better leading man than the hulking mass of nothingness who was in this film, and singer's direction is C-O-L-D. And don't even get me started on how miscast Lois was.

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I really rather like the film. Admittedly, it got me at the very beginning with the music and Brando's monologue (I'm a sucker...), but I think it looks fantastic, has some lovely little touches. Yeah, I still like it!

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It was ok. Brandon Routh had the personality of a lump of Kryptonite and wasn't convincing as either Clark Kent or Superman, the whole thing with his son was just dumb and should have been removed entirely. Lois Lane was terribly miscast, Kevin Spacey seemed bored and the whole story was dull as dishwater.

Also, this is set after Superman 2, which ends with Superman saying to the President of the United States, that he would never leave again yet he then buggers off for 5 whole years with no explanation or warning! Daft.

Still, it had the theme in it, and the aeroplane sequence was nerve tingling, edge of the seat stuff.

Man, even the theme gives me shivers. Such an amazing piece of music :wub:

Edit: also you have to contend with how inherently boring Superman is as a character. It's pure wish fulfilment fantasy; he has every power going and is, for the most part, perfect, with none of the weaknesses, frailties or doubts displayed in other heroes. He has one weakness - Kryptonite - which somehow someone always manages to get hold of to challenge him. His pantheon of villains are mostly rubbish, too. Lex Luthar is obviously awesome, but then who else is there? Brainiac? Bizarro? Good luck trying to crowbar them into a decent movie.

Batman is awesome because he's just a guy. Every mission could be his last. He gets battered, has intense emotional issues surrounding guilt and revenge, is prone to rash decision making and letting his anger get the better of him. He is a fully fleshed out character with good points and bad.

Whilst attempts have been made to do similar things with Superman in recent years, they've only been mildly successful and are quickly abandoned for the next monster of the week, Kryptonite wielding bad guy.

Superman is always going to fall to these issues because his creators saw fit to create him as the ultimate hero, but in doing so, highly restricted themselves to what they could and couldn't do with the character. The time in which he was invented needed a hero like that to help people cope with some awful times (the aftermath of the first world war, the great depression and, not long after he appeared, the second world war); but once these times were over people started wanting more from their heroes. They want them complex, fractured and fraught with inner turmoil. They want heroes that are like them; imperfect, sometimes damaged and with a lot of emotional baggage. I'm not saying every hero has to be a manic depressive and everything has to be bleak, but there does need to be some conflict other than lumps of green meteorite and lousy villains!

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I think I mentioned it in the new Superman film thread but Bryan Singer said recently that he wished he'd have opened Superman Returns with the space shuttle sequence.

Here's the post by /Film that went with the clip above -

Those of you who follow Superman lore closely will already know that the opening of Bryan Singer‘s Superman Returns was originally intended to be different than what played in theaters. The opening that was shot and ultimately discarded sees Superman (Brandon Routh) making his return to Krypton where he finds a barren rock laced with kryptonite.

The scene laid the groundwork for a few moments in the film we did eventually see, but was evidently deemed unfit to open the movie. The sequence showed up as a bonus feature on the recent Superman Anthology blu-ray set, and now it is online. Check it out below.

I’m not sure where the $10m figure comes from that is being bandied around with respect to this sequence, as I haven’t seen the original presentation of this footage. The number was originally reported by CHUD, it seems. And, given the use of effects, I am willing to believe this ran a couple million bucks a minute. While some more of this way-out sci-fi spirit would have been welcome in Superman Returns as a whole, but I can’t say I like this sequence much. It’s too empty for me; while I tend to like slower, more contemplative sequences like this, I don’t think this one communicates enough, especially as an opening.

This clip has been floating around for a little while, first on the recent Superman Anthology Blu-ray set as mentioned, then via a low-res cam capture and now in this HD YouTube presentation that hit the internet during Comic Con

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Superman works well as a symbol and inspiration which is what I think Grant M is trying to do with the Grounded arc in comics atm, but it doesn't really work well on film

Although the whole "Superman is a symbol" thing relates to my fav Batman smack down - from Infinity Crisis

Batman: You relate too much. You’re not human. You’re Superman.

Superman: I know that.

Batman: Then start acting like it. All hell has broken loose and you’re on the moon with me? The world needs you.

Superman: Telling people what to do? I’m not a god. And I’m not like you, Bruce. I don’t need to control everything.

Batman: After all these years, you know it’s not about control. It’s about trying to do everything I can. And for you, it’s about setting an example. Everyone looks up to you. They listen to you. If you tell them to fight, they’ll fight. But they need to be inspired. And let’s face it “Superman“…the last time you really inspired anyone— was when you were dead. We’re done

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