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The Formula 1 Thread

Nick_L

By Nick_L
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SharkyOB

SharkyOB

Posted
Posted

Christ, F1 has become so boring to watch. Do people honestly enjoy this? The only decent races last year where when it rained (even Ecclestone has said he wants to make a machine to make it rain on the races!) and something interesting happened. Now its just a parade lap with no real overtaking by most of the major players and cars that dont seem to be able to overtake enough. The new tech didn't change that at all.

I was hoping last seasons bore fest was a one off, but it seems the sport is doomed at least in the short term.

And for those who disagree just download any season from the late 80s or early 90s to see what the sport once was.

Can I borrow your rose tinted specs please?

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Dudley

Dudley

Posted
Posted

Yeah, people saying this are downloading highlights packages. With the obvious notable exceptions it was no different in 1990 than it is now, except there were a few more cars and what cars there WERE exploded a lot more often.

As for 2011, it's difficult to tell if things helped, and overtaking stats are semi-meaningless but the 2011 Australian Grand Prix had 29 passes for position, the highest dry race total since 2003 and the 3rd highest in the 17 year history at Albert Park. For reference, the first 3 races here (96,97,98) had 10,3 and 5 and Melbourne's average for dry races is a touch over 16. The signs, they are not bad at all.

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Agent L

Agent L

Posted
Posted

Looks like about four of us have the same fantasy line up:

Alonso, Vettel & Hamilton

:)

I went the other way and hoped that two drivers with a chance of scoring points would score more combined points than one more expensive driver that would score regularly.

I went Vettel, Alonso, Petrov and Buemi. Whilst it worked out perfectly in the first race I'm a bit sceptical about the long term chances if Buemi starts to drop out of the points and Petrov inevitably starts throwing it at the scenery.

'Nando better start pulling his socks up too or I'll be in real trouble.

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Sidewaysbob

Sidewaysbob

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Well, wasn’t that all jolly interesting and a little surprising.

It has got to be worrying for the rest of the teams though, Webber included. Vettel rolled up on Friday and never really looked back to check where everyone else was. The McLaren’s tried to spoil the party on Friday afternoon, but really the Redbull is about a gazillion miles faster with the cheeky German at the wheel. Especially considering they don’t have a KERS system fitted to that car. At the end of Qualifying it was almost a second faster than Hamilton, a country mile by anyone’s standard.

More surprising perhaps though, was the fact that the car behind Vettel was the McLaren of Hamilton. A team who two weeks ago, threw away the original design for the back of the car and started the whole thing again from scratch. To date they had not got the exhaust and gear box to go a race distance and here they were, the closest thing to a challenge.

They weren’t the only happy face in the pits on Saturday evening. Petrov had somehow kept it all together and got his car up 6th for the race. Whilst his much fancied bearded team mate had gone out in Q1. Kobayashi had also gone well sticking the Sauber into 9th just ahead of Buemi in the Torro Rosso in 10th.

Not so happy where the Ferrari and Mercedes teams. Who had both expected to be up the front giving Redbull a bit of a challenge. Alonso faffed around to a not too bad 5th but behind the McLaren’s and Redbulls, Massa over drove his car into 8th spinning as Q3 came to a close to annoy various drivers on hot laps. Rosberg did alright getting it to 7th but Schumacher who had given it all “the big I AM, I’m a winner me “, during the run up to the weekend couldn’t make out of Q2 and stopped in 11th. Hardy har har.

Also massively unhappy were the whole HRT squad, who spent most of Friday and Saturday trying to get their cars into some sort of working order. Liuzzi eventually made it out to do a few laps, but by the time Q3 ended HRT were so far behind Vettel you need something akin to the Hubble telescope to find them. They were informed by the FIA that they were no longer allowed to play with the big boys because they were just too damn slow.

Come the Race and as suspected Vettel just drove off into the distance. He didn’t look like being challenged all day, trading fastest laps with Hamilton for the first 10 laps or so. All this without a KERS system or any opportunity to use his silly flappy rear wing do darr. He just calmly and methodically blew everyone else away. When Button tried to hold him up to give Hamilton a sporting chance, Vettel just drove round the outside of him. By the end he was cruising around waving his finger around and being extremely smug and German. Winning the first race of the season always set a driver up for a good year and it’s going to be a brave soul to bet against Vettel making it two championship in a row.

Behind Vettel, Hamilton gave chase and to be fair kept him honest all day, but a broken under tray at two thirds distance put paid to his efforts. However if you’d told the plucky lad he’s be on the podium next to Vettel in Australia he’d have laughed at you .. to your face. That car was a complete mess two weeks ago and here it is up there best of the rest. If they can now develop the car as they usually do, it’ll be race winner.

In third Petrov, no I don’t know how he did it either. He didn’t hit anyone, he didn’t crash and when he got hassled by Webber he had the measure of him. All told a great result for the much derided Russian. Who I have to say was jolly nice in all his interviews afterwards and came across an likable chap. If he can do that again once Ferrari and Mercedes their act together, I shall be mightily impressed.

Alonso eventually managed to make it to 4th with a bit of luck and a tail wind. The Ferrari didn’t look all that sharp during the weekend and must have surprised the boys from Maranello, who all expected to be up there with Vettel. Alonso did alright but he was never where the action was and just sort of kept it on the grey stuff.

Webber just can’t get a break in Australia. Another 5th spot for him and he looked utterly bemused by that. His team mate was all happy smiles and “check me I’m ace me” whist the dour Ozzy just couldn’t work out why he was so far back. On the bright side he didn’t hit any one this time.

Button finally made it to 6th after spending most of the race looking at the back of Massa dog slow Ferrari. He tried lap after lap to use his flappy rear wing to get a run on the Ferrari into turn 1 but Massa was having none of it and kept pulling just far enough ahead to thwart the Brit. Finally Button made a desperate lunge up the inside of the hairpin and ran out of road. Taking to the escape road he emerged ahead then told all and sundry that he was miles ahead of Massa and it was all find and dandy. The FIA raised it McLaren eyebrow up another notch and hauled Button in for a drive through penalty. So Button did a good job to get back to 6th really and it shows that the McLaren is a car with some solid speed.

Mass made it to 7th eventually and looked rubbish all weekend. Spins in practice and qualifying, He never looked fast and must surly be counting the days till he gets his marching orders. Most defiantly a Number two driver now, he’s had his shot at the title and I doubt he’ll ever get another. Welcome to team Alonso !

Now 8th should be the Sauber of Perez who did a cracking job one stopping his way into the top ten. Massa had to make 3 stops to claw his way into the points. Whilst the young Mexican kept his nose clean and the car in one piece to get a great result. That is until the FIA checked the leading edge of the rear wing and found it had a square profile and not a round profile. A tiny tiny thing that had passed scrutinering with no trouble, got pinged in post race. Perez and Kobyashi got disqualified and that was the end of their champagne party.

In his place Buemi didn’t really do much to get 8th

Sutil got 9th as Koby got fired and this weeks “did he take part ithe race award” I missed him entirely and thankfully he missed the walls.

Finally a very lucky 10th for Di Resta. Who appears to have been told to let his team mate go past him. Welcome to big school lad. Up to that point he had been faster than Sutil all weekend, but ran out of puff as the race went on. Still it’s a good debut and let’s hope there’s more to come from him.

So all in all it was okay. I don’t think the flappy rear wing was much cope. There were a few occasions where you could see it made a difference to the driver overtaking. But mostly the drivers in the top 8 were all much of a muchness and couldn’t get much benefit from it. We’ll if it make a difference in Malaysia with a longer straight.

So the biggest suprise was the performance of Petrov, for some who spent most of last year smearing his car down the sides of walls and other cars. He did a pretty good job, that and the Renault might just be as fast as the ferrari and Merc. This should make the midfield battle interesting.

Biggest disapointment for me was the williams. Testing had shown they had a car worthy of the Williams name at last, but Pastor and Rubins where just woeful all weekend.

So that’s race one, it looks like it’s going to be Vettel benefit year, but McLaren might just be able to keep him honest.

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MrPogo

MrPogo

Posted
Posted

Looks like about four of us have the same fantasy line up:

Alonso, Vettel & Hamilton

:)

I thought there might have been more of us with that, but I guess anything McLaren was looking like a risky gamble prior to the weekend!

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Dom B

Dom B

Posted
Posted

Mass made it to 7th eventually and looked rubbish all weekend. Spins in practice and qualifying, He never looked fast and must surly be counting the days till he gets his marching orders. Most defiantly a Number two driver now, he’s had his shot at the title and I doubt he’ll ever get another. Welcome to team Alonso !

Now 8th should be the Sauber of Perez who did a cracking job one stopping his way into the top ten. Massa had to make 3 stops to claw his way into the points. Whilst the young Mexican kept his nose clean and the car in one piece to get a great result. That is until the FIA checked the leading edge of the rear wing and found it had a square profile and not a round profile. A tiny tiny thing that had passed scrutinering with no trouble, got pinged in post race. Perez and Kobyashi got disqualified and that was the end of their champagne party.

This is a bit wrong isn't it?

I thought Perez and Kobayashi were 7th and 8th ahead of Massa before the banhammer.

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Dudley

Dudley

Posted
Posted

There's so much wrong with that I don't know where to start.

Another random stat. Normally this is one of the lower overtaking races on the calendar but even if the year ends up averaging the same as this race it'll still be the "Best" season since 1990.

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sandman

sandman

Posted
Posted

I believe what's happened here is that sandman has mistaken F1 for something he actually likes.

I've been watching the sport since 1980 approx. I am quite serious when I say that I cannot fathom how on earth anyone would say that it is a better spectator sport than it was back in the 80s. It got boring once Schumacher moved to Ferrari and the teams arrogance became the over-riding force in the sport. Then he retired and things improved somewhat. I would be most interested to see viewing figures for the last 20 years to see if the masses agree with me.

Even this thread seems to be full of technical types who really get into the different types of gearbox or flux capicitor that each car has. Its great that the sport is something that they can love, but what about everybody else.

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Halkyon

Halkyon

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Posted

I get my enjoyment the flux capacitors, I find the tech to be facsinating, the DRS is so F-Zero :hug:. I also find myself rooting for the underdogs/lessers/those who I perceive to do deserve a break. This pretty much means I want Ferrari/Alonso and Schumacher to do shit and everybody else to do well.

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rafaqat

rafaqat

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Posted

I've been watching the sport since 1980 approx. I am quite serious when I say that I cannot fathom how on earth anyone would say that it is a better spectator sport than it was back in the 80s. It got boring once Schumacher moved to Ferrari and the teams arrogance became the over-riding force in the sport. Then he retired and things improved somewhat. I would be most interested to see viewing figures for the last 20 years to see if the masses agree with me.

Even this thread seems to be full of technical types who really get into the different types of gearbox or flux capicitor that each car has. Its great that the sport is something that they can love, but what about everybody else.

Perhaps you have changed. I fucking LOVED gaming back in the 90's. Now it's just not as much fun. That's mainly because I don't have the time to play rather than there being shitter games out.

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Shimmyhill

Shimmyhill

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I've been watching the sport since 1980 approx. I am quite serious when I say that I cannot fathom how on earth anyone would say that it is a better spectator sport than it was back in the 80s. It got boring once Schumacher moved to Ferrari and the teams arrogance became the over-riding force in the sport. Then he retired and things improved somewhat. I would be most interested to see viewing figures for the last 20 years to see if the masses agree with me.

Even this thread seems to be full of technical types who really get into the different types of gearbox or flux capicitor that each car has. Its great that the sport is something that they can love, but what about everybody else.

The tech aspect was the same back then, huge advancements in tech and there was probably far more reliance on the hardware than the driver than there is today - turbos, ground effects, aero, active aero, carbon fibre all happened in the 'golden era' you mention and back then you could have a car that simply dominated for a season and often for many years.

I agree the Schumacher era was not the best but mainly as Mika left the sport and Money/Ferrari dominated the sport but even during that time there was plenty of upsets with various others winning races and championships and michael breaking his leg etc.

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Dudley

Dudley

Posted
Posted

I've been watching the sport since 1980 approx. I am quite serious when I say that I cannot fathom how on earth anyone would say that it is a better spectator sport than it was back in the 80s. It got boring once Schumacher moved to Ferrari and the teams arrogance became the over-riding force in the sport. Then he retired and things improved somewhat. I would be most interested to see viewing figures for the last 20 years to see if the masses agree with me.

Even this thread seems to be full of technical types who really get into the different types of gearbox or flux capicitor that each car has. Its great that the sport is something that they can love, but what about everybody else.

They have the rest of motorsport.

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Pete

Pete

Posted
Posted

Probably been mentioned but the documentary on iplayer called formula one: the killer years is actually really good despite the title.

Some wonderful of old school cars, those guys were properly mental.

Anyway I've loved the last few seasons and am looking forward to this one, bit concerned Vettel will run away with it but it's early days.

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Sidewaysbob

Sidewaysbob

Posted
Posted

The golden years we all about mansell. Piquet. Senna and prost. They were the only drivers that won anything back it the day. Honda was the only engine worth having. And it used to be deathly dull at times.

F1 has always had very little overtaking in it. Because if you lime the drivers up with the fastest driver at the front. You don't set it up for overtaking.

If you want to see drivers overtaking come to le man's with me and see an audi driver coming back through the field after he's lost a lap or two on the pits. With 24 hours of rating and 5 different classes

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kiroquai

kiroquai

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I've always considered the golden age to be when I started viewing (1988) - Piquet, Senna, Mansell, Prost etc. Big tyres, big egos, big moustaches... great stuff. I guess it will depend on when you began viewing really; on the motorsport forum I am on there's a huge age variation, and there's a couple of guys who were born after I began watching who talk about the late 90's in the same way I regard my golden age. There's also a guy who's been watching since the early 1960's and he gets misty eyed about Clark, Surtees, Gurney and the like and considers anything after about 1976 to have been average.

Thing is, I remember those early years (from say '88 to '91) fondly, but I go back and watch the full races now and I don't feel them to be any more exciting or entertaining that what we have now. Watching the FIA review tapes and the BBC highlights of the period kind of gave me an unrealistic impression of the races being more eventful than they were.

Going back even further, I managed to get some DVD's of the entire 1978 and 1979 races, in full (also in German, but never mind) and even though I love the cars, the drivers and the circuits, I found the races really quite dull to watch in a way. Obviously with hindsight it's a bit special being able to watch Peterson, Villeneuve, Depailler and de Angelis at work knowing what happened to them, but the races themselves were pretty processional.

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mexos

mexos

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Thing is, I remember those early years (from say '88 to '91) fondly, but I go back and watch the full races now and I don't feel them to be any more exciting or entertaining that what we have now. Watching the FIA review tapes and the BBC highlights of the period kind of gave me an unrealistic impression of the races being more eventful than they were.

Going back even further, I managed to get some DVD's of the entire 1978 and 1979 races, in full (also in German, but never mind) and even though I love the cars, the drivers and the circuits, I found the races really quite dull to watch in a way. Obviously with hindsight it's a bit special being able to watch Peterson, Villeneuve, Depailler and de Angelis at work knowing what happened to them, but the races themselves were pretty processional.

Exactly.

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mexos

mexos

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Posted

It was appalling. Any driver that just drove past should have been bloody ashamed of themselves/borderline charged for neglecting to help a fellow person in need. And the incompetence of the marshals has to be seen to be believed.

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