The Wednesday Thread

[Rev]

Co-op side with Wednesday asking for extension, 28 days now to find a buyer. So we get this basic form of terror spread out for another month.

[waddie]

Probably not the full 28 days: next winding up petition hearing is December 1st. We've got a fortnight, really.

[Rev]

Probably not the full 28 days: next winding up petition hearing is December 1st. We've got a fortnight, really.

I don't think it'd be hard to get that extended to the end of this 28 day period if needed.

We need someone to buy us in the next, say, 15 minutes ideally.

[mirodo]

What a difference a week and a half makes!

:-D

[joeplus]

Quietly optimistic over here. The big thing is avoiding administration points penalties, we look like we're making a good fist of a promotion push.

[El Pibe]

Did you guys see this?

Wednesday highlights

[dan_tm]

Woah, I haven't seen this thread for a while.

But no, that video seems to be no longer available (was it before midnight?). To be honest, I'd avoided watching those highlights anyway, was there anything in particular you were referring to in them?

PS. I'm massively looking forward to seeing who we'll pick up in January with a bit of cash behind us now. The names we've been linked with (although only rumours) are much more encouraging than the usual nobodies. St. Ledger and Buddle especially, although the latter is clearly way out of our league with several Premiership teams also watching him closely.

Its been nice to read terms like "ambitious Sheffield Wednesday" in the papers as well recently, rather than the usual "debt-ridden" or "cash-strapped", etc.

[El Pibe]

Nah, nothing in particular. Just some great goals from City!

[neoELITE]

I'm massively looking forward to seeing who we'll pick up in January with a bit of cash behind us now.

Reda Johnson according to our official website. He's very tall but I'm not too sad to see him leave as he's part of a central defending pair the home fans lovingly call the Chuckle Brothers.

I'm fairly irritated that we're £9m in debt and are being forced to sell our senior pros whereas Wednesday were in more debt and are now allowed to sign players. I know you've got more potential to get out of the debt and play in a higher league (Wednesday are a massive club in League 1) but I'm getting sick of football for this reason.

[waddie]

Reda Johnson according to our official website. He's very tall but I'm not too sad to see him leave as he's part of a central defending pair the home fans lovingly call the Chuckle Brothers.

Is he really that bad? A lot of your fans sound pretty gutted to see him go. 22 is still pretty young for a CB.

To be honest, a promising but error-prone young player would make a nice change from the experienced but error-prone ageing crocks Beevers has been partnered with for the last few years. At least we'd have hope they might improve, instead of watching them get steadily worse week after week.

I'm fairly irritated that we're £9m in debt and are being forced to sell our senior pros whereas Wednesday were in more debt and are now allowed to sign players. I know you've got more potential to get out of the debt and play in a higher league (Wednesday are a massive club in League 1) but I'm getting sick of football for this reason.

It's unpaid tax bills that land you with a transfer embargo, rather than debt itself. Granted, being a big club helped us attract the investment we needed, but we're hardly an example of everything that's wrong with football. Apart from the bank, Mandarić reached an agreement with all our creditors for the amount owed, and considering the millions we paid the Co-Op servicing the loans over the years, I doubt they've done worse than break even. They certainly seemed happy enough with their £9m.

Our financial problems stemmed from a couple of shite managers signing players on contracts we could only afford in the Premiership, when the club still looked like challenging for honours. Buying players has been a rare novelty for us ever since that relegation. Most of our current squad arrived as free transfers, free agents, or from our Academy. For all their faults, the last board were never much for spending beyond our means.

We're not exactly a Cardiff or Leeds.

Not that Argyle are either, obviously.

[dan_tm]

I'm fairly irritated that we're £9m in debt and are being forced to sell our senior pros whereas Wednesday were in more debt and are now allowed to sign players. I know you've got more potential to get out of the debt and play in a higher league (Wednesday are a massive club in League 1) but I'm getting sick of football for this reason.

I've read loads of comments like this over the last few weeks, unfortunately most 'other' fans don't seem to know our situation (previous, or current) in much detail.

Basically, cutting a long story incredibly short, we've now paid all our debts and didn't enter administration at any point - so it seems a bit unfair that we still seem to be receiving the same sort of treatment clubs like Cardiff, Leeds, Portsmouth, etc, etc receive for pissing money up the wall and not paying back their creditors in full.

I'm not really sure what we're supposed to have done wrong; we've struggled with debt for 10+ years, paying it off steadily, living within our means and spent virtually nothing in the last decade. It would have been incredibly easy to take the administration route at any point over the last 10 years but we did it the hard way and struggled on with the mistakes from the past.

Thankfully we've now been set free and the income from our gate receipts can be spent on the team, rather than endlessly paying off the bank.

[waddie]

It would have been incredibly easy to take the administration route at any point over the last 10 years but we did it the hard way and struggled on with the mistakes from the past.

To be fair, it had more to do with the tossers in charge and their self-interest than any great virtue. It was the hard way for the fans, but just about the best outcome the board could hope for, and it was their decision to make.

[dan_tm]

Totally, yeah. I don't know how much you've read up about our recent history behind the scenes (i.e. all Lee Strafford's whistle-blowing documents in regards to the previous board), but there was some truly shocking behaviour going on.

The impression I got was that the board were (allegedly) destroying the club almost on purpose in an attempt to buy a bigger share of it from the bank for as little personal outlay as possible, due to the terrible depths we'd fallen to under their stewardship.

Hence the protests when it was finally made clear that members of the previous board (Mick Wright especially) were bidding to re-buy the club from the bank just prior to Mandaric publicly declaring his interest.

[waddie]

I tried now and then, but it was hard enough to follow a largely anonymous slanging match with everyone insisting they knew who each participant really was but not daring to identify them for fear of being sued, even without the admins locking and deleting the entire mess three times a day.

What a bloody shower. Exeter could put 5 past us every season for the next ten and I'd still count us better off.

I picked up enough to tell there was something fishy with the Wright bid, but I wasn't entirely convinced by what I saw of Strafford's version of events. Didn't he accuse Parker of stitching him up to the detriment of the club? I can't reconcile that with the guy who gave that statement outside the court in November. If Parker was faking that, he should be on stage.

[waddie]

Daftest signing rumor so far has to be Aliadière. I mean, former promising young Arsenal player whose recent career has been spent injured, on the bench or unproductive does sound like our kind of guy, but he's a free agent. You'd think the lack of a ridiculously inflated transfer fee would put us off.

[dan_tm]

Irvine then; I think he could be gone at some point today.

In a way it's unfortunate that our next game is in the FA Cup, as a new manager coming in wouldn't want to start their first game as massive underdogs, while the fans are still going to be expecting at least a close game at the bare minimum. On the other hand though, giving Irvine the cup match would be pointless, as even if he wins it it's hard to put up a decent argument to keep him in charge any more. Mandaric said at the Q&A session just after the 6-2 win against Bristol Rovers that Irvine is in no danger of getting the sack (he's hardly going to say otherwise), but that he should make sure "not to lose too many points between now and January". I know we've had 3 games called off recently, but that's now two defeats from two since he said that - 4 losses from the last 5 games (inc. JPT) as well.

I'm not one of the fans who was quick to get on his back, I've supported him 100% until the last 2 or 3 weeks (see my posts on Owlstalk), but there comes a point when lines are crossed. Nine defeats in the league already, when we're not even half-way through, is just not good enough at all for a team trying to reach the automatic promotion spots. His record against the better teams in the division is frankly embarrassing, so even if we did make the play-offs (which is far lower than we should be aiming) we've got no chance of progressing through them this time around.

This is all before bringing up last year's relegation, which while clearly not totally Irvine's fault (thanks Brian!) he still had almost half the season to turn us around. He looked like he was going to manage it easily with the start he had with us, but zero wins from our final nine games in the Championship last season was seemingly just giving up without a fight. Palace did us a massive favour allowing it to go down to that last game wire, but even then, in front of just shy of 40,000 people we couldn't put together one last performance to keep our place in the division.

At least now that Mandaric is in charge I have total faith that he won't allow Irvine to outstay his welcome for too much longer.

[waddie]

We put more points on the board per game under Irvine last season than we'd managed any season under Sturrock or Laws since the 2005 promotion, and finished it 1 goal from survival. I think some fans underestimate how deep a hole we were in when he joined. It was an almost impossible task for that squad even with Palace's points deduction.

I don't think we're doing too badly this season, considering all our promotion rivals spent money while he was cobbling together a new squad with nothing. I reckon he deserves one transfer window with money to spend to sort it out. 2-3 players could make a world of difference.

[Mitchell]

We were fucking shit yesterday. Otsemobor is not a defender, Spurr did his usual 'running in treacle' routine, JJ got pissed off and went missing when things didn't go his way (AGAIN)...I could go on. If it wasn't for Weaver, they would've had a hatload.

But no fear! Irvine is here! He knows how to change a game, and bring on the deadly playmaker that is Chris Sedgewick!

[waddie]

Otsemobor was looking promising earlier in the season. Apparently he was carrying an injury for most of the match yesterday.

The bench isn't exactly packed with game-changing impact players, but leaving it until the last 2 minutes before bringing Heffernan on was bizarre. Palmer might have been worth a gamble, I suppose.

Réda Johnson confirmed, anyway. 3½ year deal, undisclosed fee. Not cup-tied, could play on Saturday.

[El Pibe]

I wish we could play you guys every week!

[dan_tm]

So, anyone catch Football Heaven last night? They had an interview with Mandaric regarding transfer policy.

Basically we're in for 6 players minimum (his words). Obviously Reda Johnson is the first, and from the interview he also revealed he was off to London (last night) to finalise the deal for Leicester's Michael Morrison. So that's two centre backs pretty much in the bag, what other areas do you guys think we should get some new blood in?

Personally, for the other four, I'd go for a left back, a right back (yay, new defence!) a centre midfielder and a right winger. Mandaric made it obvious he's looking for a striker though, and confirmed that we'd been talking to Buddle's people. To be honest, I think our forward line is in no need of improvement, especially compared to the other positions I mentioned. The only thing we could do with up there is a bit more pace.

There's going to be another interview with him tonight (although recorded at the same time) in regards to Irvine. Sounds like with the new signings it's make or break that we get promotion at the first attempt now, it seems almost certain that he won't be here if we're not in the Championship this summer.

[dan_tm]

I'll have a dig at a possible post-January team then:

                       Weaver

NEW RB     Johnson/Purse     Morrison/Buxton     NEW LB

NEW RW         Miller         NEW CM       Teale/Jones

      Morrison/Heffernan        Mellor/Johnson

[edit]

Just read that right back might actually be Morrison's best position, even though he's usually known for playing centre back it seems.

In which case he could slot straight in there and perhaps Buxton could come back in as CB, unless we get a new one in. Sean St. Ledger please!

[waddie]

The positions that need attention look about right, CM and LB being the priorities for me. I doubt they're all going to be direct replacements though. The squad's smaller than it looks: I can't see Hinds ever getting a game again, and in an ideal world kids like Modest and Nyoni would be getting some experience out on loan. Otsemobor and Purse have both had to play through injuries this season. I'd like to think Spurr and Beevers still have a future at the club, for example, they're both young, and we've asked an awful lot of them over the last couple of years.

Morrison/Heffernan

Heffernan's barely allowed near the pitch now, never mind if we're in for another striker.

[Sirloin]

I'll have a dig at a possible post-January team then:

                       Weaver

NEW RB     Johnson/Purse     Morrison/Buxton     NEW LB

NEW RW         Miller         NEW CM       Teale/Jones

      Morrison/Heffernan        Mellor/Johnson

[edit]

Just read that right back might actually be Morrison's best position, even though he's usually known for playing centre back it seems.

In which case he could slot straight in there and perhaps Buxton could come back in as CB, unless we get a new one in. Sean St. Ledger please!

He's fine with either, he's very strong in the air, so centre back is probably his better position. But he's quite mobile for his size, so is good on the flanks. His passing isn't great mind, so not sure you would want him crossing too much. He's a very solid player though, and will be a very good buy for you, shame to see him leave Leicester, but I think Championship is about his level at the moment.

[dan_tm]

I was encouraged to read on the BBC article that Leicester tried to persuade him to stay, sounds like we've just got a bargain (£250k?) on a pretty solid top-end Championship-level player. Still young too, it'd be great if he and Beevers went on to form a long-term successful CB pairing, if it works out they could be playing alongside each other for 3 or 4 years at their age.

[Sirloin]

I was encouraged to read on the BBC article that Leicester tried to persuade him to stay, sounds like we've just got a bargain (£250k?) on a pretty solid top-end Championship-level player. Still young too, it'd be great if he and Beevers went on to form a long-term successful CB pairing, if it works out they could be playing alongside each other for 3 or 4 years at their age.

Yeah definitely, he's played the last couple of games for us and has been one of our strongest players. He hasn't had much of a chance under Sven, which is a shame as I think he could have developed really well. I think with us bringing in 2 new centre backs he doesn't see a place for himself at Leicester, which is a shame. 250K for him is an absolute steal.

[waddie]

Morrison confirmed, 3½ year deal, undisclosed fee, allocated number six, mentions he's "equally at home" at right back.

[waddie]

Great result today. Sounded like City had our defence under pressure throughout but Réda and M Morrison still had time to get involved at the other end of the pitch. Awesome couple of signings there. Sedgwick and Teale playing well, Clinton got a goal, and the first time we've made it to the fourth round since 00/01.

("Irvine out!" - Owlstalk)

[dan_tm]

Just read that our victory against Bristol City was our first ever in our history against higher league opposition, away from home in the FA Cup.

Anyway, Wycombe or Hereford at home in the 4th round then - what does everyone think? Personally I'd have preferred one of the 'big' draws (but only the biggest, Tottenham/Man City at the very bottom end), but this was the next best thing in my opinion. At least we now have a fairly good chance of progressing to the 5th round, as for all Irvine's faults - underestimating opposition certainly isn't one of them and we've always seemed to perform well against the 'lesser' sides recently.

3rd + 4th round prize money (regardless of extra TV/ticket income) totals almost £160k too, which could pay for another player to make sure we get out of this god-awful division in a few short months.

Apparently we're due to hear if there's any possibility of Edson Buddle getting a work permit for the UK today as well, although it was rumoured last night that he's about to sign for a team towards the bottom of the German 2nd tier, which is a bit of a surprise.

[hellsbells]

As long as we don't bottle it I'd say that's a great 4th round draw. I found it strange watching the draw and actually caring about it. Seems ridiculous that we haven't made it past the 3rd in such a long time but it's nice to have something positive to chat about in this thread for a change!