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LongHairStu

The Edge Definitive Top 100 Thread

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This is true. Hell - I like Guitar Hero a lot, but it's nothing compared to the genius of Frequency.

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I always feel like I must be some kind of idiot when I read conversations like that. I genuinely think Amplitude's a better game than Frequency, and Guitar Hero's better than either of them.

Which is not to say that GH's presence in the list justifies the lack of Frequency/Amplitude, however. They're awesome, and sufficiently different that there should have been room for both GH and one of the others. I'd say Amplitude, but I'm aware that puts me in the minority.

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No LBA. No Crazy Taxi. Okami overrated again. Deus Ex not in the top 10. Only two of the top 10 deserving (maybe three, depending how generous to Tetris I'm feeling), and neither of them got to above #7. A Tekken title in the list. No Syndicate. PilotWings 64 too low. Worst of all, no Fallout! And to add further insult, Oblivion in the top 20. Gash.

But at least they included Rome: TW, Thief (too low, mind), Ico, Rez, Disgaea, Nights, F-Zero GX, Starcraft and Outrun 2006 in there.

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I always feel like I must be some kind of idiot when I read conversations like that. I genuinely think Amplitude's a better game than Frequency, and Guitar Hero's better than either of them.

Which is not to say that GH's presence in the list justifies the lack of Frequency/Amplitude, however. They're awesome, and sufficiently different that there should have been room for both GH and one of the others. I'd say Amplitude, but I'm aware that puts me in the minority.

I think part of it must come down to the fact that we fell so much in love with Frequency that any changes to the formula just felt wrong. I remember all we wanted from a follow-up was a bunch more songs to play, a fresh challenge. I can never fathom why they went from the tunnel to the plane, for one thing - that just broke the flow.

In the height of my Frequency obsession I'd get up and play it before going to work, spend all day subconsciously tapping my fingers and all but rush home to get back on it. In winter I used to get pissed off that my hands were too cold to play properly after coming home. I'd have to wait a couple of hours to get the fingers up to the task.

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I always feel like I must be some kind of idiot when I read conversations like that. I genuinely think Amplitude's a better game than Frequency, and Guitar Hero's better than either of them.

Which is not to say that GH's presence in the list justifies the lack of Frequency/Amplitude, however. They're awesome, and sufficiently different that there should have been room for both GH and one of the others. I'd say Amplitude, but I'm aware that puts me in the minority.

You're not an idiot, of course not. But it's a fundamental, inescapable, 100% irrefutable fact that Amplitude is a broken game in comparison and thus inferior to Frequency. This has nothing to do with basic stylistic or musical preferences, it's a pure gameplay thing.

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I sincerely hope this is some kind of horrific joke. I'm going to have to bite my hands off to stop myself from launching into yet another forum rant as to why Harmonix have broken my heart.

How? Frequency was always a niche title. I assume Amplitude sold more because it didn't have as many obscure artists in, and even that was still fairly niche. Harmonix needed to do Guitar Hero to carry on, I'm pretty sure.

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I dunno. I thought it was a nice list of games. Of course mine would be different and there are some curious entries, and some baffling omissions - but overall the only stinkers I spotted were the dreadful Psychonauts and the frankly broken Ridge Racers 2.
but overall the only stinkers I spotted were the dreadful Psychonauts and the frankly broken Ridge Racers 2.
I spotted were the dreadful Psychonauts and the frankly broken Ridge Racers 2.
dreadful Psychonauts
dreadful Psychonauts

=/

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I liked that post, I liked it a lot.

And not just because I agreed with the sentiment put forward.

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I thought Psychonauts was nice, and clearly under appreciated, but its inclusion on the list is a bit odd. It has a wealth of good ideas but I'd rather some of the games with good ideas with execution to match had made it on instead.

Hardly a horribly-overlooked Beyond Good and Evil though....

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Amplitude is a broken game in comparison and thus inferior to Frequency.

How so? Genuine question. I own them both and have played them extensively, so you don't actually need to describe the gameplay in much detail for me - just your opinions on the differences. (sorry for going OT btw)

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Psychonauts is a load of old turd. Pretentious instead of fun. Like its turd room mate, Killer7. And I know that many people don't see the appeal of Ridge Racer games, but the is nothing broken about Ridge Racers 2. A very lazy sequel, sure, but it plays like a dream. I think is the best game in the series. And again, it was in my top 10.

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Psychonauts = Emperor's new clothes.

It's shite. Trust me. I talk with God.

I thought it was pretty decent, but Meat Circus ruins my memories of the title completely.

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How so? Genuine question. I own them both and have played them extensively, so you don't actually need to describe the gameplay in much detail for me - just your opinions on the differences. (sorry for going OT btw)

Alas the search function is busted right now so I can't just C&P previous explanations I've done on this and it's quite late and I'm tired so I'll edit it tomorrow or something.

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Bah, Psychonauts was great, and I hate (and am rubbish at) platformers. Only Meat Circus upset me (that and the fact the game doesn't allow you to explore after the ending. Bah!). One of the two 3D platformers I've ever managed to complete (t'other being Sonic Adventure, though god knows why I played through it all).

Killer 7 though, yeah, a bit shit. Interesting plot, but I never got to see much of it thanks to the crummy gameplay putting me off at every turn.

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It's an okay list and it'll inspire debate until their next list.

A few sticking points:

- No Grim Fandango, which I consider the best graphic adventure of all time. It could've been in there instead of Psychonauts.

- No Sonic the Hedgehog? Regardless of how the series has fallen, Sonic 1 is still a wonderful experience that took made platform games fast, instead of plodding.

- SF anniversary is a bit of a cop-out. I'd have like to have seen which out of SFIII:Third Strike and SSF2T they would have placed higher.

- MGS2 instead of MGS1 or MGS3. MGS1 had a great plot, cool characters and is still great fun today. MGS3 also had a very memorable cast and the best gameplay. MGS2 gets kudos for one of gamings biggest twists of all time, but with it's weaker cast of characters, a less likeable hero and almost non-sensical plot, it lacks the things that make it the definite MGS game to include.

- Killer 7? Is it really a top 100 game to enjoy or simply one people should play?

- No Bejewelled 2? God that game sucks hours of time from people's lives.

- Tetris Attack is better than Tetris. Aren't people over Tetris?

- Shenmue 2 is better than the first one.

- Chrono Trigger should have been rated higher. It's the best 16 bit rpg on consoles.

For those that have the magazine, do they actually revisit the game with today's eyes? Or do they just link to old reviews?

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Bah, Psychonauts was great, and I hate (and am rubbish at) platformers. Only Meat Circus upset me (that and the fact the game doesn't allow you to explore after the ending. Bah!). One of the two 3D platformers I've ever managed to complete (t'other being Sonic Adventure, though god knows why I played through it all).

Killer 7 though, yeah, a bit shit. Interesting plot, but I never got to see much of it thanks to the crummy gameplay putting me off at every turn.

The other way round for me. I thought Psychonauts' gameplay didn't fit at all, and that's because it was transformed from a point-and-click to a platformer. The pacing was all wrong, and it was a collectathon for much of the time. Even the Gogglor level was annoying because you moved so slowly. Pity, as there was much to praise in the invention, the art design and the dialogue.

killer7 has one of the best stories in any videogame, with streamlined exploration (meaning much less tedious meandering) and fun lightgun-esque shooting sections. And some incredible art and sound design.

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I must be an idiot then because I absolutely loved Psychonauts, even the Meat Circus level was good, I didn't have any problems with it, maybe I just have awesome skills. I didn't imagine it would make the top 100, but it would definatley be in my top 50. I initially was very unusure with all the "collect 100 of these to get this" and "collect all of those for that" but after a couple of hours, I never looked back. Lovely game made with great imagination and lots of love.

The only games missing from the list I would like to have seen are:

- Elite and Dungeon Master should be there, but maybe if they don't stand up to today's standards then fair do's but I still play both today and they play wonderfully.

- Beyond Good and Evil must be there somewhere (sob!) I guess just not enough people bought it then.

- Yeah I go along with Sonic, stick Sonic 2 in there.

- No Hot Shots Golf, I've clocked hundreds of hours with the series.

- I'm surprised that Crackdown is there, would have thought Gears of War would have been higher, not that I'm saying it is the better game.

- and Ouendan must surely be top 20 material, my fave ever handheld game and in my top 10. I guess Gitaroo Man being there makes it a bit easier to take...

Overall thought, excellent (if 90% predictable) list. I would only agree with about 40 of those games but it's a great read and am relieved they didn't just re-use old reviews. Needs more screenshots though.

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The other way round for me. I thought Psychonauts' gameplay didn't fit at all, and that's because it was transformed from a point-and-click to a platformer. The pacing was all wrong, and it was a collectathon for much of the time. Even the Gogglor level was annoying because you moved so slowly. Pity, as there was much to praise in the invention, the art design and the dialogue.

I'll expand on my last post. Psychonauts for me single-handedly reinvigorated the 3D platform genre, considering I thought that I had stopped finding those games enjoyable before I played it.

Additionally, it has some of the best character design / art direction of a game, in my opinion. Much of it looks like a Pixar film. (Obviously not in terms of graphics)

The "Milkman Conspiracy" level is probably also one of the most funny gaming experiences I've ever had.

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Sorry to keep dragging it up, but I think the ultimate problem of Frequency was its soundtrack. There's so much gash it's untrue. There's a few good tracks by Roni Size, Mindfields, BT, Fear Factory, but most of it is throwaway stuff for pillheads. I don't know how anyone mustered up the effort to complete the final tier - all shit. Compare that to GH, which ends with Edgar Winter Group, Pantera and Ozzy Osbourne classics. Not much competition, that.

EDIT: And the concept of Frequency is a lot more confusing than GH.

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Sorry to keep dragging it up, but I think the ultimate problem of Frequency was its soundtrack. There's so much gash it's untrue. There's a few good tracks by Roni Size, Mindfields, BT, Fear Factory, but most of it is throwaway stuff for pillheads. I don't know how anyone mustered up the effort to complete the final tier - all shit. Compare that to GH, which ends with Edgar Winter Group, Pantera and Ozzy Osbourne classics. Not much competition, that.

Quit being the shit-stirrer, silly. You thought Amplitude was better.

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Only 'cause the timing was less harsh. And it looked prettier. And the soundtrack was less bad.

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Woo, more thread resurrection.

It is out on Monday, or possibly already. It will cost £10. Yes, £10. And the top ten is apparently:

1. The Legend Of Zelda: Ocarina Of Time

2. Resident Evil 4.

3. Super Mario 64.

4. Half-Life 2

5. Super Mario World

6. The Legend Of Zelda: A Link To The Past

7. Halo

8. Final Fantasy XII

9. Tetris

10. Super Metroid

Thanks, World Of Stuart!

Wow. Of that top ten, I've only played three of them. And I've only played one of those three for less than 1/2 an hour.

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