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Troublegum

3DS
Nintendo 3DS - first thread

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I would buy a new 3DS - and cry tears about why, even though it was obviously better, having a single stick was the best

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The rival home consoles to the Wii had twin stick controllers as standard as well.

Yeah Wii also launched with a twin stick controller, and then a pro version a few years later.
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Edit: So it makes sence:

3 live nintendo streams tommorow!

http://www.nintendo.co.uk/NOE/en_GB/news/nintendo_direct_47764.html

UK Times

11AM - Japan withe english subs announcement from japan

Noon - Europe announcement

2PM - USA reggie announcement - all in the same link above!!!

orig post:

Live stream via Nintendo Europe

http://www.nintendo....rect_47764.html

This is 22/02/2012:

11 AM GMT for Japan Subtitled:

That will be followed by the Nintendo Europe message at midday. You can watch it at nintendo.co.uk.

Finally, Reggie Fils-Aime will be delivering his own Nintendo Direct video tomorrow afternoon at 2pm.

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Yeah Wii also launched with a twin stick controller, and then a pro version a few years later.

An optional peripheral which adds additional control functionality but never becomes a standard part of the machine? If only they could do the same for the 3D

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So? A 3DS with 6 fantastic games, is the same price as a Vita with 1 game. The Vita doesn't do glasses free 3D. Do Sony need to bring out a hardware revision? The Vita hasn't got dual screens. Again, do Sony need to bring out a hardware revision? The Vita isn't "in your pocket" portable. Hardware revision?

For third parties basically, particularly Western ones whose control schemes lend themselves better to dual analogue control. Games like COD.

There is zero chance of Nintendo rolling out a new/revised 3DS for quite some time yet. Its simply not needed at all. Just like twin sticks.

No one expected the Control Pad Pro either. Three games already support it with more on the way.
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An optional peripheral which adds additional control functionality but never becomes a standard part of the machine? If only they could do the same for the 3D

Its become the accepted standard like it or not. Even the next Nintendo home console supports it.
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For third parties basically, particularly Western ones whose control schemes lend themselves better to dual analogue control. Games like COD.

No one expected the Control Pad Pro either. Three games already support it with more on the way.

For the 3DS i've got a footie game, a platformer, a racing/driving game, a 3rd person adventure game, an RPG, a 3rd person shooter/horror game, a pinball game, amongst others. None of them need a second stick. They all play brilliantly without one. If games are designed well around the standard 3DS controls, there's not a problem.

The CPP is optional, meaning games will always be designed primarily around the standard 3DS controls. Games that do ideally need twin sticks are ports of certain big console games and possibly very specific genres.

Nintendo will not release a twin stick 3DS. At least not for quite some time yet. Doing so would split Nintendo's market and potentially make the old 3DS obsolete, thus destroying Nintendo's own business and trashing their own reputation in the handheld market.

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For the 3DS i've got a footie game, a platformer, a racing/driving game, a 3rd person adventure game, an RPG, a 3rd person shooter/horror game, a pinball game, amongst others. None of them need a second stick. They all play brilliantly without one. If games are designed well around the standard 3DS controls, there's not a problem.

This is all well and good but the fact remains that a large proportion of control schemes for core games are better suited to dual analogue.

The CPP is optional, meaning games will always be designed primarily around the standard 3DS controls. Games that do ideally need twin sticks are ports of certain big console games and possibly very specific genres.

It was rushed out along with Monster Hunter to go against the Vita launch in Japan. Releasing a peripheral as ugly and cumbersome as the Control Pad Pro that early in the consoles life was an admission that only one analogue controller was an oversight.

Nintendo will not release a twin stick 3DS. At least not for quite some time yet. Doing so would split Nintendo's market and potentially make the old 3DS obsolete, thus destroying Nintendo's own business and trashing their own reputation in the handheld market.

It wouldn't need to split the market at all. As you said, dual analogue controls are optional at the moment for games that support the CPP. There's no reason for that to change until the number of dual analogue units outnumbers the standard 3DS. For that reason it makes sense to launch a revised two stick model ASAP whilst the 3DS still has a relatively small userbase. By the end of its cycle it should be well outnumbered and dual analogue controls will be standard rather than optional.
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This is all well and good but the fact remains that a large proportion of control schemes for core games are better suited to dual analogue.

It wouldn't need to split the market at all. As you said, dual analogue controls are optional at the moment for games that support the CPP. There's no reason for that to change until the number of dual analogue units outnumbers the standard 3DS. For that reason it makes sense to launch a revised two stick model ASAP whilst the 3DS still has a relatively small userbase. By the end of its cycle it should be well outnumbered and dual analogue controls will be standard rather than optional.

Games are only suited to dual analogue controls, if the controller has twin sticks! As i've said, if games are designed around the standard 3DS controls there's not a problem. You're on the Skyward Sword thread praising that game. It doesn't use a second stick. Its designed around the systems controls, making great use of them and its all the better for it.

I personally think the 3DS should have had a second stick as standard. It hasn't though.

Have to say, imo your comments make little to no sense. If a 3DS with twin sticks as standard is released, it would mean all games would then be designed around dual analogue. There'd be no real reason for developers to do this though as there's no market to sell to, the vast majority of 3DS owners have a single stick machine. If developers did start designing games around twin stick controls though, these owners would be fucked and stuck with botched controls or games that simply weren't playable on their consoles. Its not going to happen. Nintendo aren't daft.

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If a 3DS with twin sticks as standard is released, it would mean all games would then be designed around dual analogue.

It doesn't mean that at all. There's plenty of games that don't and wouldn't use two sticks whether the 3DS has one or two sticks. Platformers would only use one stick.

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Aside from a possible redesign, what I'm looking for:

Monster Hunter TriG annocement for Europe!

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Games are only suited to dual analogue controls, if the controller has twin sticks! As i've said, if games are designed around the standard 3DS controls there's not a problem. You're on the Skyward Sword thread praising that game. It doesn't use a second stick. Its designed around the systems controls, making great use of them and its all the better for it.

I personally think the 3DS should have had a second stick as standard. It hasn't though.

Have to say, imo your comments make little to no sense. If a 3DS with twin sticks as standard is released, it would mean all games would then be designed around dual analogue. There'd be no real reason for developers to do this though as there's no market to sell to, the vast majority of 3DS owners have a single stick machine. If developers did start designing games around twin stick controls though, these owners would be fucked and stuck with botched controls or games that simply weren't playable on their consoles. Its not going to happen. Nintendo aren't daft.

With all due respect, if my comments make little to no sense then Nintendo wouldn't have released the CPP in the first place. They'd have encouraged developers to design and optimise their games for the standard 3DS. That way they wouldn't confuse or marginalise their userbase, as you suggest.

Already, games which have been in development way before this peripheral was announced have made use of it and it's only been out a couple of months.

The peripheral likely came about in the first place due to pressure from third parties, yet already one of Nintendos own first party games shortly to be released will support it too.

Think of the amount of cross platform releases the 3DS might miss out on if it doesnt support dual analogue as standard in future. Then ask yourself why Nintendo wouldn't want as many of their machines as possible out there to include it.

If thsts not enough consider how a revision of the standard 3DS would work out. Nintendo wouldn't want the next 5 or 6 years of the consoles life almost literally dragging the CPP around like a ball and chain.

They want twin sticks and they want it ASAP. The CPP would not exist otherwise.

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At the moment there is an awful piece of plastic that developers are making Twin Stick controls for, as well as keeping single stick controls for the people who don't have it.

Why would this have to change if they released updated kit?

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It doesn't mean that at all. There's plenty of games that don't and wouldn't use two sticks whether the 3DS has one or two sticks. Platformers would only use one stick.

You've misunderstood me. I've already said what you're getting at in one of my above posts.

The point i'm making is releasing a new 3DS with twin sticks as standard, is nothing like the difference between DS to DSI. Changing the standard controls of the machine is HUGE. It would be more along the lines of 3DS 2 rather than a slight redesign. It would be a total disaster.

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Aside from a possible redesign, what I'm looking for:

Monster Hunter TriG annocement for Europe!

That's already been announced hasn't it? I'm sure I saw somewhere recently that mentioned an edge article with it down for 3rd quarter?

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The point i'm making is releasing a new 3DS with twin sticks as standard, is nothing like the difference between DS to DSI. Changing the standard controls of the machine is HUGE. It would be more along the lines of 3DS 2 rather than a slight redesign. It would be a total disaster.

I agree. Stanley is the only person that doesn't.

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With all due respect, if my comments make little to no sense then Nintendo wouldn't have released the CPP in the first place. They'd have encouraged developers to design and optimise their games for the standard 3DS. That way they wouldn't confuse or marginalise their userbase, as you suggest.

Already, games which have been in development way before this peripheral was announced have made use of it and it's only been out a couple of months.

The peripheral likely came about in the first place due to pressure from third parties, yet already one of Nintendos own first party games shortly to be released will support it too.

Think of the amount of cross platform releases the 3DS might miss out on if it doesnt support dual analogue as standard in future. Then ask yourself why Nintendo wouldn't want as many of their machines as possible out there to include it.

If thsts not enough consider how a revision of the standard 3DS would work out. Nintendo wouldn't want the next 5 or 6 years of the consoles life almost literally dragging the CPP around like a ball and chain.

They want trim sticks and they want it ASAP. The CPP would not exist otherwise.

You've totally missed the point, that if Nintendo wanted dual sticks, then why did they themselves design the 3DS with a single stick?

All the 3DS games ARE designed around the standard one stick controls and work perfectly. The CPP is OPTIONAL. Like an old school rumble pack or whatever.

By first party Nintendo titles that incorporate the CPP, do you mean Kid Icarus? Its used in the game for left handed players! The game is designed around single stick controls, just like every other 3DS game.

I don't think you've really thought things through properly.

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You've totally missed the point, that if Nintendo wanted dual sticks, then why did they themselves design the 3DS with a single stick?

As I said earlier, it was an oversight. A rather big oversight which they are now attempting to patch up.

All the 3DS games ARE designed around the standard one stick controls and work perfectly. The CPP is OPTIONAL. Like an old school rumble pack or whatever.

They are at the moment but we're yet to see 2nd generation 3DS titles, and the machine isn't even a year old yet. Already though developers are offering optimised control methods for the CPP. And rumble; you said earlier it's a massive addition adding another stick - now its no more than adding rumble.

By first party Nintendo titles that incorporate the CPP, do you mean Kid Icarus? Its used in the game for left handed players! The game is designed around single stick controls, just like every other 3DS game.

Regardless it supports the add-on and will be advertised as such.

I don't think you've really thought things through properly.

You appear to be saying, or have actually alresty explicitly stated, that's there's no point in the CPP. The games are perfect without it.

If that was the case. If everything was 'perfect' with just the one stick, there would be no need for the CPP, or dual analogue control at all.

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That's already been announced hasn't it? I'm sure I saw somewhere recently that mentioned an edge article with it down for 3rd quarter?

Lots of european mags like edge, N Gamer, Nintendo Gamer, Official Rag has given it dates of Summer and Q3 and even on-line added for us but nothing official from nintendo or capcom :o

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I don't really see the advantage to them in now doing a revision this early to add a stick. If it was six months ago and the Vita was selling well, maybe, but it really doesn't make sense for them to do it now.

Stranger things have happened though, so it may well happen. If it does, I think it'll be some sort of 3DS Pro, maybe with bigger screens and a better battery. It'll never be the new standard model though.

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As I said earlier, it was an oversight. A rather big oversight which they are now attempting to patch up.

They are at the moment but we're yet to see 2nd generation 3DS titles, and the machine isn't even a year old yet. Already though developers are offering optimised control methods for the CPP. And rumble; you said earlier it's a massive addition adding another stick - now its no more than adding rumble.

Regardless it supports the add-on and will be advertised as such.

You appear to be saying, or have actually alresty explicitly stated, that's there's no point in the CPP. The games are perfect without it.

If that was the case. If everything was 'perfect' with just the one stick, there would be no need for the CPP, or dual analogue control at all.

This is getting daft. What do you not understand about something being optional? You're ignoring the fact that all 3DS games are primarily designed around the standard controls. The option to use a second stick is like having the option to use a rumble pack.

That all changes if you release a new 3DS with twin stick controls as standard. All the consoles sold before that decision are basically fucked. Why would any company build up a large user base, that's generating said company a shit load of money, then suddenly complicate things by crippling its own product, that's already doing well in its market and anger its loyal customers in the process? It doesn't make any sense at all.

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This is getting daft. What do you not understand about something being optional? You're ignoring the fact that all 3DS games are primarily designed around the standard controls.

And some games are better with a second stick.

The option to use a second stick is like having the option to use a rumble pack.

Terrible comparison. The only way they're comparable is that they're optional.

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And some games are better with a second stick.

Terrible comparison. The only way they're comparable is that they're optional.

You've misunderstood me again. Some games might be better with a second stick in certain peoples opinions (i've already said the 3DS should have had a second stick). That doesn't change anything though. The games are still primarily designed to be used with a single stick set-up. As you've already posted, not all games even need a second stick, and often in ones that do its not vital. Which brand new, designed for 3DS game, NEEDS a second stick to be played? There isn't one.

Terrible comparison? I'm comparing them because they are optional options. They are optional. OPTIONAL! DO YOU SEE?

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This is getting daft. What do you not understand about something being optional? You're ignoring the fact that all 3DS games are primarily designed around the standard controls. The option to use a second stick is like having the option to use a rumble pack.

well I've tried to address all your points, I'll just be repeating myself answering this again.

That all changes if you release a new 3DS with twin stick controls as standard. All the consoles sold before that decision are basically fucked. Why would any company build up a large user base, that's generating said company a shit load of money, then suddenly complicate things by crippling its own product, that's already doing well in its market and anger its loyal customers in the process? It doesn't make any sense at all.

it makes sense for all the reasons you are conveniently ignoring. You are not addressing the points anyone is making
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You've misunderstood me again. Some games might be better with a second stick in certain peoples opinions (i've already said the 3DS should have had a second stick). That doesn't change anything though. The games are still primarily designed to be used with a single stick set-up. As you've already posted, not all games even need a second stick, and often in ones that do its not vital. Which brand new, designed for 3DS game, NEEDS a second stick to be played? There isn't one.

Terrible comparison? I'm comparing them because they are optional options. They are optional. OPTIONAL! DO YOU SEE?

My reasons for saying they're not comparable is more complicated than yours. Yours is simply that they're both optional. It appears we're arguing different things.

I got the wrong end of the stick and ran with it.

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