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Vimster

The "Not Quite Hip-hop, Not Quite Dubstep" Thread

97 posts in this topic

Couldn't find a thread on this, could be dubstep-related but thought it deserved a thread of it's own.

It's wonky, sort of broken hip-hop, it throws all the rules about pristine production in the bin where it got it's beats from. It bumps along nicely, has a real punch to it, but swaggers along like a scruffily-dressed-yet-decent person, for want of a much better description.

Here are a few tracks I've tracked down for example:

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeprbWirQaU&feature=related"]Hudson Mohawke - Bottle Caps[/url]
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kabsUvHyrOg&feature=related"]Heralds Of Change - Stay Cool[/url]
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6xbO9qLcdc"]Lone - Sea Spray[/url]
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3epmUGyBUf8&feature=related"]Rustie - Zig Zag[/url]

Not necessarily wonky but very close to it:
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_HVSvErbmE"]Percee P & Diamond D - 2 Brothers From The Gutter[/url] (produced by Madlib)
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDWgtB_MD24"]Roots Manuva - Witness The Fitness[/url] (superb video)

You could include some IDM people in there like Autechre, Funkstorung, or perhaps more hip-hop people like the late J Dilla.

Such a great sound, can you think of any more tracks/artists that might fit?
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I always personally associated Wonky with the off-kilter, synth-heavy/8-bit dubstep that's coming out now, rather than the Dilla influenced hiphop.

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAkQ4buLBzw"]Joker - GullyBrook Lane[/url]
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3HUmNGrEiU"]Starkey - Gutter Music[/url]
Zomby's last EP on Hyperdub particularly, totally kills it - [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSHHzgFobU8"]Aquafresh[/url] / [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_try6rtAoRk"]1UP[/url] / [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV-3moOnCOA"]Kaliko[/url]

I may be completely wrong. Although I get the sense that none of the producers really like the genre tag - as if it's a tag that's been given for music that doesn't really fit anywhere. I'm not sure I could go to an entire club night of the music, or even listen to a full 90 minute mix, but for the odd track to listen to it's some of the most exciting and interesting music out there. Rustie's ZigZag track especially completely blew my mind last year, it's fucking light years ahead.

Really like that Heralds of Change track, just picked up the EP from emusic.
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Ha! Funny I should see Starkey's Gutter Music in here; been loving it over the last week - the first drop is just brilliance.

Edit: Nice one on the Joker track too - just noticed it's 3K Lane.

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHkpgwq_884"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHkpgwq_884[/url]

This wobble/wonk stuff is a pretty big characteristic of certain dubstep artists, you'll notice it a lot if you listen around.
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[quote name='bph' post='5969162' date='Mar 30 2009, 11:03 PM']I always personally associated Wonky with the off-kilter, synth-heavy/8-bit dubstep that's coming out now, rather than the Dilla influenced hiphop.

I may be completely wrong. Although I get the sense that none of the producers really like the genre tag - as if it's a tag that's been given for music that doesn't really fit anywhere.[/quote]
As you say it's not really a genre as such, more a convenient tag. Listening to the dubstep end of it just reminded me of Madlib and some of the more leftfield Dilla stuff - joining the dots, as they say.

As for the Heralds Of Change, Spotted off the Puzzles EP is bloody amazing, can't see that on Youtube, sadly.
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I think [url="http://www.last.fm/music/Samiyam"]Samiyam[/url] has been thrown in with this lot, too. I'm rather fond of his stuff, particularly Rap Beats Vol. 1.
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[quote name='Vimster' post='5968915' date='Mar 30 2009, 09:48 PM'][url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3epmUGyBUf8&feature=related"]Rustie - Zig Zag[/url][/quote]

This is brilliant
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Having listened to a few of the ace tracks linked to in this thread I'm putting Flying Lotus into this genre that isn't a genre. I'm not really sure dubstep is a music style either really - just a pigeon hole for a certain area of somehow-linked sounds. More of that kind of thing.
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If I can chuck in my piece, to my ears dubstep sounds like a jungle track but without the amen. I expect it to break out all the time, but it doesn't. Maybe it will head towards a more jungly sound at some point, but it doesn't sound quite complete to me.
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[url="http://www.thisisluckyme.com"]LuckyMe collective - home of Mike Slott, Rustie, Hudson Mo, Nadsroic etc etc[/url].

But dinnae say "wonky" to any of them. or [url="http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/musicblog/2009/mar/05/wonky-ketamine-dubstep-zomby"]ketamine[/url].

If you're looking for more of this stuff check the [url="http://www.boomkat.com/item.cfm?id=34258"]beat dimensions vol.1[/url] compilation. Vol 2 is coming out soon.

I'd also recommend checking out Dorian Concept. He's dope.
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That Guardian Music Blog article led me to try the Zomby EP and it's great. The tracks are very short and sweet with a definite games flavour.
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I've been listening to some Wonky stuff of late. Leaning more towards the hip-hop side of things....

[b]Hi-Res[/b] - [url="http://www.myspace.com/hiresolutionmusic"]http://www.myspace.com/hiresolutionmusic[/url]
Free beat-tape - [url="http://www.zshare.net/download/556370161974c2f1/"]http://www.zshare.net/download/556370161974c2f1/[/url]

[b]Mike Slott[/b] - [url="http://www.myspace.com/mikeslottbeats"]http://www.myspace.com/mikeslottbeats[/url]
[url="http://www.boomkat.com/item.cfm?id=143043"]Knock Knock[/url] and [url="http://www.boomkat.com/item.cfm?id=173364"]Boxed In[/url] are 2 of my current favourites

[b]Onra[/b] - [url="http://www.myspace.com/onra"]http://www.myspace.com/onra[/url]
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18TFz5oMplQ"]My Comet[/url] is another current fave, his other stuff is less wonky.

[b]Jamie Vexd[/b] In System Travel EP on Planet Mu - [url="http://www.boomkat.com/item.cfm?id=174055"]http://www.boomkat.com/item.cfm?id=174055[/url]
Title track is my personal highlight, all good shit though. Did a crazy remix of [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9lqLlc9CBY"]Scuba[/url] too.

Not 100% Wonky (if anything can be!) but [b]Dam Funk[/b] has a sweet selection of loose synth funk beats on his Stones Throw mini LP.
Rhythm Trax Vol.4 promo - [url="http://vimeo.com/2806157"]http://vimeo.com/2806157[/url]

Bit late I know, but I also just picked up on [b]Flying Lotus[/b].
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Just for the crack I thought I'd have a go at making some of this sort of thing, [url="http://gorehole.org/vim/vim_-_melted.mp3"]here's what I came up with[/url]. It felt really good making it, you can just let go and enjoy yourself, and you can feel the weight as you cram the beat in.

/blatant-whoring-of-tunes
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Aye Mike Slott is amazing. You can get a remix he did of one of my tunes from the [url="http://www.suso.co.uk/features/luckyme-in-the-city"]Susology[/url] website.

(It's "American Men – ‘Ammn Sys M1’ (Mike Slott Golden Remix)
")
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Yeah it's strange, I think the remix is really great, but I had just assumed the drums were gonna be all over the place for some reason (although thinking about it it probably wouldn't have gone with the track).

And cheers, I've tried that link again and it seems to be working. Hadn't heard Hi-Res before; really impressed with the tunes on his player.
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Got sent a link to this earlier, interesting read - an in-depth intellectual and musical critique of Wonky, linking it in with other artforms and styles of music. A reasonably long read (8000 words according to MS Word!) but I found it pretty fascinating and haven't really read anything like it before on dance music:

[url="http://rougesfoam.blogspot.com/2009/06/loving-wonky.html"]http://rougesfoam.blogspot.com/2009/06/loving-wonky.html[/url]

He's even attempted to musically notate Zomby's Kaliko! First section below:

[img]http://i42.tinypic.com/2j69ttz.jpg[/img]
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[quote name='bph' post='6137050' date='Jun 4 2009, 11:20 PM']Got sent a link to this earlier, interesting read - an in-depth intellectual and musical critique of Wonky, linking it in with other artforms and styles of music. A reasonably long read (8000 words according to MS Word!) but I found it pretty fascinating and haven't really read anything like it before on dance music:

[url="http://rougesfoam.blogspot.com/2009/06/loving-wonky.html"]http://rougesfoam.blogspot.com/2009/06/loving-wonky.html[/url]

He's even attempted to musically notate Zomby's Kaliko! First section below:[/quote]

Amazing!

Looks like its worth the read.
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Hmm, I read it all but it waffled a lot without coming to any solid conclusions. It was a fairly interesting read though for the most part, and if nothing else it alerted me to the wonders of Hudson Mohawke.
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yeah it went on a bit. Who has the time to write this stuff? And what for?!

I respect that this guy has spent time on it. But why notate kaliko? I mean, it's an interesting song, for all the reasons that he mentions - but it sems to me that these days anyone musically attuned enough to be able to read and follow the notation would be able to just listen to the song and hear what was going on - ie. it's not going to introduce anyone to anything new I don't think.

But I have to say I come to this from the perspectives of both a musician and a fan, and in both capacities as someone who struggles to see the point in "serious" criticism of music.

Hudson Mohawke is great.

*SPAM*

Don't mean to pimp our website [i]too[/i] much, but he's part of the LuckyMe collective, and you can get all sorts of good mixtapes from hudmo, mike slott, rustie, dema, jay prada, me )and the guests from our Glasgow club night, ballers social club) at [url="http://www.thisisluckyme.com/html/mixes.html"]http://www.thisisluckyme.com/html/mixes.html[/url].

*END SPAM*
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[url="http://pitchfork.com/forkcast/12987-sugarette/"]http://pitchfork.com/forkcast/12987-sugarette/[/url]

From Bibio's new album.
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[quote name='Shoes' post='6156528' date='Jun 12 2009, 02:26 PM'][url="http://pitchfork.com/forkcast/12987-sugarette/"]http://pitchfork.com/forkcast/12987-sugarette/[/url]

From Bibio's new album.[/quote]
Simply cannot wait for this album. Less than a fortnight.
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[quote name='Shoes' post='6156528' date='Jun 12 2009, 02:26 PM'][url="http://pitchfork.com/forkcast/12987-sugarette/"]http://pitchfork.com/forkcast/12987-sugarette/[/url]

From Bibio's new album.[/quote]
Like the sound of this. Will have to investigate.
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