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Mr. Gerbik

Stealth The Tenchu Series - Acquire sneaking onto PlayStation 4!

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Don't forget that this is made by the same team that gave us Shinobido and the first Tenchu game. As you can see by the vids I posted, they're all about experimenting with new gameplay and aren't afraid to do something different. I've said many times in this thread that I couldn't be happier that Acquire is back on Tenchu, and it looks like I was right - they're definitely not afraid to take the series in a new direction, and in doing so they're bringing some much-needed innovation to a classic series that had become extremely stale.

If you ask me, they shouldn't have lost the Tenchu ip in the first place, and I really hope From Software is smart enough to keep them on as developers for future Tenchu games. I remember reading something about Acquire wanting to do a 'Tenchu trilogy' and that would mean at least two more Acquire Tenchu games. And, as fun and as promising as Tenchu 4 looks, I would also like to see what they could do on the PS3 or the 360. Either of those consoles would have the obvious advantage of allowing for both detailed and bigger environments without loading screens in-between, and maybe allow them to do more with physics and the guards AI.
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[quote name='Mr. Gerbik' post='5482490' date='Oct 11 2008, 12:29 AM']I would also like to see what they could do on the PS3 or the 360. Either of those consoles would have the obvious advantage of allowing for both detailed and bigger environments without loading screens in-between, and maybe allow them to do more with physics and the guards AI.[/quote]

I'm gonna hold off as long as possible, but this makes me seriously consider buying a Wii.
I think Tenchu 1 is one of the best games of all times...

I read somewhere that the grappling hook is no more in T4 - is that right?
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I love Tenchu (couldnae stand Shinobido though) and this installment looks brilliant. I'd be there day one but I don't have a Wii. Have to try to convince my brother to buy it for his and maybe work out a short term console swap, because this needs to be played. Obviously I'm with Gerbik in that I'd like the Tenchu series to reappear on PS3 for selfish reasons, but this title looks great. I'm not going to buy a Wii for it, but it's one of the few Wii games where I like pretty much everything I've seen about it.
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Good to know that I'm not the only one who thinks it's looking good :D

Tbh Kinketsu, the Tenchu 4 announcement the only thing prevented me from selling my Wii, so I can understand that you don't want to buy a Wii just for this game. Just convince your brother to lend you his Wii for awhile.

About the grappling hook: judging by the videos, the grappling hook is out. In the vids you can see Rikimaru placing objects near walls to reach higher places, and you can also see Ayame stabbing her dagger into a wall to create a makeshift ladder (I liked that btw :angry: ). We don't know for sure if the grappling hook is definitely gone, but it wouldn't surprise me considering this is a pretty big overhaul of the Tenchu series.
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IGN TGS08 preview [url="http://wii.ign.com/articles/917/917627p1.html"]here[/url]. In the preview, IGN refers to From Software as the developer, good to know that IGN is as incompetent as ever.

Interesting bits:
[quote]The assassinations are very satisfying, and it's nice that you can pull off a variety of graceful killing blows so easily. Rikimaru and Ayume each have around 25 unique hissatsu (assassination) moves. Enemies that are grouped together can all be taken out at once by chaining together gestures. Eliminating three guards at once is a breeze -- as it should be for a ninja.[/quote]
25 unique stealth-kill animations each! :) :wub:

[quote]To get a good sense of their environment, players can use their "mind's eye" to detect enemies and items. By hitting the Z button, you will enter your mind's eye where the action stops, you can rotate the camera, and important people and objects are highlighted. Red lights emanating from the eyes of enemies indicate their field of vision, allowing you to plan your route. If you are close enough to a guard you might even overhear their voices through the remote speaker, revealing clues about the level.[/quote]
We already saw this in the walkthrough videos posted earlier, and it sounds... interesting. This could either work really well or really piss off the hardcore Tenchu fans. If it only adds to the tactical possibilities and the tension, then I'm all for it. We shall see, but judging by the walkthrough vids I'm optimistic..

[quote]Unfortunately, Ubisoft was unable to include the Japanese voice track because of space issues. But the publisher says it is taking localization very seriously and hopes to produce a high quality English track. What we heard was maybe a little cheesy, but it was more of a dialogue issue than performance. Rikimaru is voiced by an actor who appears in Naruto.[/quote]
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! You stupid motherfuckers! If there's not enough space on the disc, then don't bother with any English track at all. I don't want to play as an American redneck Ninja :P This is a clear case of Blu-ray FTW.

[quote]While we were generally impressed with Tenchu 4, there are a couple areas that need attention. The game is being released shortly in Japan but there are some collision detection and AI issues. There were times we would assassinate a guard right in front of another enemy and he just stood there, watching us eviscerate his buddy. But Ubisoft says the North American release next year will be more polished than the Japanese version. The game already has a slick interface, title screen, and menus, but the in-game graphics and AI could use just a little work. Despite the simplified controls it looks like there will be plenty of meat here for the hardcore. Three difficulties are available and after a level is completed its "shadow mode" will be unlocked, adding more enemies to the level and increasing their aggression level.[/quote]
Shadow Mode sounds great! Hardcore stealthing, Tenchu-style is a good thing imo. Collision detection sounds worrisome, but it looked fine in the videos. Like the AI, it looks like it could be better but it shouldn't have any impact on my enjoyment from the game if previous Tenchu's are anything to go by. And I still say the graphics look pretty good compared to most Wii games and all the other Tenchu games, what did IGN expect - the fucking Unreal Engine 3?


The article also mentions that you can take three items with you when starting a level, and any items you find are selectable for future levels. The cat sounds great, it can meow to convince a guard that there's no Ninja hiding in them there bushes, it has a mind's eye of it's own, and can even retrieve items for you!

Overall, the article is very optimistic about Tenchu 4. The only negative remarks are in my last quote, and apart from the English voice track ( :D ), it's still looking very good.
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[quote name='YellowSamuel' post='5485931' date='Oct 13 2008, 12:42 AM']How is this Tenchu 4? I can think of at least 5 others off the top of my head.[/quote]
[i]Tenchu: Stealth Assassins[/i] is the original game for the first Playstation, developed by Acquire. This is officially Tenchu 1. [i]Tenchu: Shinobi Gaisen[/i] was an expansion of the first game, released only in Japan with a level editor (which was brilliant for its time, you could share levels via the memory card)

[i]Tenchu 2: Birth of the Stealth Assassins[/i] is the second Tenchu game, also developed by Acquire, but flawed because they tried to do things the humble psx simply couldn't handle.

[i]Tenchu: Wrath of Heaven[/i] is officially Tenchu 3, released for the PS2 and the xbox (as [i]Return from Darkness[/i]). The xbox version is far superior because it has extra levels (ironically these extra levels are also the best levels in the game), new abilities and items, a better camera, and (crucially) an option in the pause screen to restart a level without going back to the titlescreen first as you would in the PS2 version. It was developed by K2 and wasn't too bad, but nowhere near as good as Stealth Assassins.

[i]Tenchu: Fatal Shadows[/i] for the PS2 is a sidestory focusing on Ayame and another female character, it's better than [i]Wrath of Heaven[/i] imho, but nothing special. Then there was also [i]Tenchu: Time of the Assassins[/i] for the PSP, which was utterly awful, and [i]Tenchu: Dark Secret[/i] for the DS which was even worse. [i]Tenchu Z[/i] is the Xbox 360 game, and it's good fun (I liked it), but again nowhere near as good as the first Tenchu (but better than [i]Wrath of Heaven[/i] and [i]Fatal Shadows[/i].) All these games are 'side-stories' and therefore not part of the 'proper' Tenchu series. Tenchu 4 for the Wii is officially the fourth Tenchu game.
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Imagine this: Tenchu 4: Revolution

After Sony releases their version of Wiimote, Acquire upgrades the assets to HD resolution & improves the AI.

...rrrright. I'll get my coat ;)
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Famitsu review roundup (didnt say which one)

8
- Each stage is separated into “areas” that you have to clear.
- Degree of freedom is thin
- Discovering clearing routes is fun
- Controls in Duel Mode are difficult to get a hang of

7
- emphasis on secrecy is strong, especially given the fact that you fail instantly if you’re being discovered
- The “sandbox” feeling inevitably fades away because of the way the stages are defined.
- Duel Mode controls are difficult

8
- The fact that being discovered = instant failure makes the game thrilling
- Difficulty level has been raised
- It’s easy to have fun playing given the way the stages are defined.

6
- You can easily pull off killing blows
- Development is monotonous, “old school”.
- movement is sluggish
- the fact that the 3rd person point of view doesn’t give you much freedom is also annoying.



Also remember that the western version will have additional features/fixes and english only voice :)
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Thanks for posting that, shynra!
[quote]-Discovering clearing routes is fun
-emphasis on secrecy is strong, especially given the fact that you fail instantly if you’re being discovered
-Difficulty level has been raised
-You can easily pull off killing blows
-Development is monotonous, “old school[/quote]
I like these observations, they all make the game sound very promising. I like the fact that they've apparently decide to make a really "hardcore" stealth game (instant fail if discovered, difficulty increased) but compensated that by making stealth-kills easy to pull off and in that way preventing any frustration that you had in earlier Tenchu and Hitman games where you could sometimes be discovered because a stealth-kill didn't register properly.
It may sound wierd, but monotonous old-school development (if I understand correctly what they mean by that) is also good as far as I'm concerned. I like my Tenchu ninja-stealth games as 'pure' as possible if you know what I mean. Pure stealth, with levels increasing in difficulty and amount of enemies the further you get in the game. No ill-advised "follow the target and see where he goes!" levels that are only there to offer the player some variation, while all I want is MORE stealth and taking my sweet time if I want to.

[quote]Degree of freedom is thin
The “sandbox” feeling inevitably fades away because of the way the stages are defined.[/quote]
This, however, doesn't sound too promising. I really have to see for myself, because if there's enough room within the relatively small areas to experiment with different approaches and tactics, I won't mind the lack of 'true' sandbox levels.

[quote]Duel Mode controls are difficult[/quote]
Non-issue, really. I'm not planning on being discovered so I couldn't care less if the duel mode controls are good or not :(
As far as I can tell, it's possible to stealth-kill the bosses, and in that case it's just an extra incentive to be even more stealthy.

[quote]english only voice[/quote]
Whoever decided to ditch the Japanese voices should be shot, simple as that. Great way to completely ruin the atmosphere and immersion :)
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Images have been turned back on! (Thanks Rob!)

To celebrate, let me post the Japanese box art of Tenchu 4:
[img]http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n269/BobbyAnalog_2006/tenchu4box.jpg[/img]
I like!

And some nice screens:
[img]http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n269/BobbyAnalog_2006/tenchu4screen05.jpg[/img]

[img]http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n269/BobbyAnalog_2006/tenchu4screen02.jpg[/img]

[img]http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n269/BobbyAnalog_2006/tenchu4screen03.jpg[/img]
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Please don't kill me, but do ya reckon there's any chance of this (or like, a Director's Cut edition or something) coming to the other platforms? I'd rather just play this with a normal pad ;)

Speaking of Tenchu; I saw a new one available through XBLA - It's absolute fucking shite. What the hell. Just give me this please. Don't make me turn on my Wii or something!!1
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[quote name='hanzo' post='5495118' date='Oct 15 2008, 08:43 PM']Please don't kill me, but do ya reckon there's any chance of this (or like, a Director's Cut edition or something) coming to the other platforms? I'd rather just play this with a normal pad ;)[/quote]
I don't like waggle either, and I'm afraid there are no plans for a proper next-gen version. There were a few rumours about a PSP version floating about, I will post any official confirmation in this thread, but that's probably not what you were hoping for.

Our best bet is that this game does really well, or at least well enough for Acquire to be able to make Tenchu 5, and hopefully they will decide to develop it for the PS3 or 360 this time. They're already working on Way of the Samurai 3 for the PS3, so they should have plenty of experience with the PS3's esoteric inner workings by the time they start working on the next Tenchu.
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[quote name='Mr. Gerbik' post='5495143' date='Oct 15 2008, 07:50 PM']I don't like waggle either, and I'm afraid there are no plans for a proper next-gen version. There were a few rumours about a PSP version floating about, I will post any official confirmation in this thread, but that's probably not what you were hoping for.

Our best bet is that this game does really well, or at least well enough for Acquire to be able to make Tenchu 5, and hopefully they will decide to develop it for the PS3 or 360 this time. They're already working on Way of the Samurai 3 for the PS3, so they should have plenty of experience with the PS3's esoteric inner workings by the time they start working on the next Tenchu.[/quote]

Aw come on, a well implemented Wii control sheme is just as good as any pad setting surely? Mario Galaxy and Metroid come to mind.

It's controls might stink of course, but when devs get controls right, they get them right, regardless of the input device.
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[quote name='Sarlaccfood' post='5495792' date='Oct 15 2008, 11:29 PM']Aw come on, a well implemented Wii control sheme is just as good as any pad setting surely? Mario Galaxy and Metroid come to mind.
It's controls might stink of course, but when devs get controls right, they get them right, regardless of the input device.[/quote]
Call me old fashioned but for a stealth game like this I'd much prefer the reliable feel of two analogue sticks for movement and camera control. I dislike the nunchuk/mote split for traditional games like this (even Mario Galaxy, which in my opinion didn't utilise the Wiimote cleverly for any benefit whatsoever. It just sort of used it. Nothing against the game), it just feels contrived. Don't really want to start a debate or anything, I just don't think games like this benefit at all from being exclusively on the Wii.
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[quote name='Sarlaccfood' post='5495792' date='Oct 16 2008, 12:29 AM']Aw come on, a well implemented Wii control sheme is just as good as any pad setting surely? Mario Galaxy and Metroid come to mind.

It's controls might stink of course, but when devs get controls right, they get them right, regardless of the input device.[/quote]
It's a matter of personal preference - I don't like Waggle and I never will. It won't stop me from playing games like Galaxy and enjoying them, but I will always prefer normal joypads. For what it's worth, I don't like m+kb either. Notice that Tenchu 4 having waggle-controls hasn't made me any less enthusiastic about the game. I would have preferred a PS3 or 360 version with next-gen graphics and normal controls, but I'm still really looking forward to the game (as you can tell by all my posts in this thread.)
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[quote name='hanzo' post='5495118' date='Oct 15 2008, 08:43 PM']Speaking of Tenchu; I saw a new one available through XBLA - It's absolute fucking shite. What the hell. Just give me this please. Don't make me turn on my Wii or something!!1[/quote]
Yeah, maybe I should have mentioned in this thread that everybody should avoid the XBLA Tenchu at all costs, it's truly awful. When it suddenly appeared on the marketplace, I somehow thought that it was a HD remake with analogue controls of the first Tenchu: Stealth Assassins. Can you imagine it? The first Tenchu is still the best in terms of level-design, atmosphere, and just all-round brilliance. The only things that haven't aged well at all are the controls (d-pad wtf?) and the graphics, which were basic even when it first came out. A HD remake would be the most amazing thing ever but I doubt it will happen, and I still don't know why I suddenly thought about it when I saw the new Tenchu on XBLA.
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[quote name='Mr. Gerbik' post='5495831' date='Oct 15 2008, 11:43 PM']Yeah, maybe I should have mentioned in this thread that everybody should avoid the XBLA Tenchu at all costs, it's truly awful. When it suddenly appeared on the marketplace, I somehow thought that it was a HD remake with analogue controls of the first Tenchu: Stealth Assassins. Can you imagine it? The first Tenchu is still the best in terms of level-design, atmosphere, and just all-round brilliance. The only things that haven't aged well at all are the controls (d-pad wtf?) and the graphics, which were basic even when it first came out. A HD remake would be the most amazing thing ever, but I doubt it will happen, and I still don't know why I suddenly thought about it when I saw the new Tenchu on XBLA.[/quote]
I literally thought the exact same thing and got well excited! :) They would have made tons of money (and probably saved dev costs/time). Instead they go off and develop a bloody Tenchu Bomberman clone that nobody asked for. I mean, what?! Yeah, that's really gonna sell!
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Don't tell Microsoft (we don't want those bastards to get any crazy ideas) but I would gladly pay even full price for a remake of Stealth Assassins. It would be my GotY, no contest - no matter how brilliant LBP, Fallout 3, Mirror's Edge or any other game will turn out to be.
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[quote name='Mr. Gerbik' post='5495831' date='Oct 15 2008, 11:43 PM']Yeah, maybe I should have mentioned in this thread that everybody should avoid the XBLA Tenchu at all costs, it's truly awful. When it suddenly appeared on the marketplace, I somehow thought that it was a HD remake with analogue controls of the first Tenchu: Stealth Assassins. Can you imagine it? The first Tenchu is still the best in terms of level-design, atmosphere, and just all-round brilliance. The only things that haven't aged well at all are the controls (d-pad wtf?) and the graphics, which were basic even when it first came out. A HD remake would be the most amazing thing ever but I doubt it will happen, and I still don't know why I suddenly thought about it when I saw the new Tenchu on XBLA.[/quote]

Yeah I can understand that. A game could be controlled by a yoyo and an ironing board if the game was built around it, but I guess this game has it's core mechanics made with a pad in mind. I'd love to see a HD Tenchu or Shinobido but I guess they went for the larger user base.

Still looking forward to this though. They really seem to have some new interesting ideas even after all these years of the series.
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Yeah, I like them messing with the formula a bit, it makes the different games stand out as individuals. You can see from the gameplay videos of this that while it has a Tenchu feel, some of the mechanics look quite different. To be honest I'm not sure the game would work as well as a port to the PS360. I'm with Gerbik in that I'd like to see this game be a hit, and then the team move on to a ground up PS3 Tenchu.

As Gerbik said, they are working on Way of the Samurai 3 (which reminds me, I should dig that thread up again with some of the (small) updates included) and are getting to grips with next gen tech. Way of the Samurai 3 looks somewhat like a souped up PS2 game. So by the time of an imaginary Tenchu 5, they could have a much better idea of what they are doing. RGG Kenzan to RGG 3 can be used as a measuring stick for what difference a year can make in terms of learning the new technology.

A small pet peeve at the end here : I hate reading some of the previews for this game online because it's clear the people writing them have no idea what they are talking about. They are almost as bad as the English media previews for RGG. For instance, one preview I read was going on about the fact that new to this game, you can hide underwater with a bamboo pipe. You could do this in Tenchu 2! Meanwhile, half of the new stuff in this game wasn't mentioned! Grr!
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[quote name='Kinketsu' post='5495993' date='Oct 16 2008, 01:57 AM']Yeah, I like them messing with the formula a bit, it makes the different games stand out as individuals. You can see from the gameplay videos of this that while it has a Tenchu feel, some of the mechanics look quite different. To be honest I'm not sure the game would work as well as a port to the PS360. I'm with Gerbik in that I'd like to see this game be a hit, and then the team move on to a ground up PS3 Tenchu.

As Gerbik said, they are working on Way of the Samurai 3 (which reminds me, I should dig that thread up again with some of the (small) updates included) and are getting to grips with next gen tech. Way of the Samurai 3 looks somewhat like a souped up PS2 game. So by the time of an imaginary Tenchu 5, they could have a much better idea of what they are doing. RGG Kenzan to RGG 3 can be used as a measuring stick for what difference a year can make in terms of learning the new technology.

A small pet peeve at the end here : I hate reading some of the previews for this game online because it's clear the people writing them have no idea what they are talking about. They are almost as bad as the English media previews for RGG. For instance, one preview I read was going on about the fact that new to this game, you can hide underwater with a bamboo pipe. You could do this in Tenchu 2! Meanwhile, half of the new stuff in this game wasn't mentioned! Grr![/quote]
I think it's good to clarify that you're talking about Yakuza: Kenzan and Yakuza 3 there, I'd imagine that not everybody knows that it's called Ryu ga Gotoku in Japan. And you're completely right about the difference a year and some experience can make, Yakuza 3 looks fucking amazing. Tenchu 5 on the PS3 with graphics as impressive as those in Yakuza 3... I think I would literally explode with my brain not being able to contain my level of excitement if that really happened.

I agree about the previews btw, Tenchu is an acquired ( :D ) taste and sending some journo that knows nothing about the series beyond the stuff he could find on wikipedia isn't going to help. They should send [i]me [/i]instead, then we would really see some proper Tenchu previewing up in here. In the meantime I'll keep doing my best to find and post as much info as I can, and once I've modded my Wii to play imports (sometime by the end of this month) I shall post my definitive review, from the perspective of an oldschool Tenchu fan.

Oh and please update the Way of the Samurai 3 thread if you've got some new info, however small. I'm really interested in that game, I think it looks great even if the graphics are not everything they could be :)
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Some gaijin playing an English version of Tenchu 4 at TGS08 has posted his vids on YouTube:

[url="http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=yC9_tjoaJfE&feature=related"]Part 1[/url]
[url="http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=hkA8RPX3jOk"]Part 2[/url]

The second vid is more interesting, because it has cat-waggling! Check it out! Apart from that he seems to have no problems with the controls, he manages to sneak around okay. Btw, the lucky [s]bastard[/s] guy has also posted a bunch of vids of other games he played at TGS08, if anyone's interested.
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So, having never played a Tenchu game before... Is it like Hitman? It certainly looks that way according to the vids. Or is it more action oriented?
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[quote name='mdn2' post='5496234' date='Oct 16 2008, 08:55 AM']So, having never played a Tenchu game before... Is it like Hitman? It certainly looks that way according to the vids. Or is it more action oriented?[/quote]
No, Tenchu games are nothing like Hitman games at all. Tenchu 4 seems to borrow some elements from Hitman, like poisoning food or the water supply, but it's still very different. Tenchu's stealth system is more traditional, it 's all about staying in the shadows whereas Hitman is unique in its 'hiding in plain sight by not attracting attention' approach to stealth.
Also, the levels in Hitman are always open sandbox environments with loads of NPC walking around, but in Tenchu there are mostly guards patrolling or watching a limited area. There are innocents sometimes, but they are just obstacles to be avoided, and not elements of a bigger puzzle like in Hitman.

So, no. If you like stealth games Tenchu is worth a try, stealth doesn't come more hardcore than Tenchu and Thief. But if you want more Hitman, then you'll have to patiently wait for Hitman 5 like the rest of us. Oh and anyone reading this thread who hasn't played Hitman: Blood Money yet, [url="http://www.rllmukforum.com/index.php?showtopic=108048"]here[/url] is the thread, and [url="http://www.rllmukforum.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=108048&view=findpost&p=5484566"]this[/url] is recent a post of mine explaining how brilliant the game is. I would avoid older posts, because I noticed that the spoiler tags have somehow disappeared and there is a huge spoiler being discussed.
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